Mirko Vučinić (36 Viewers)

Juve_fanatic

Second coolest member!
Apr 5, 2006
7,617
Matri was never the player to score+18goals season, but he was always good at dribbling and creating chances for himself.
So he was a questionable finisher and a good dribbler, when we bought him.

He is young enough to develop into a hard core finisher, it might work, or it might not work, but we can tell for sure that he can provide the support of SS at any case.
Considering that he is talented and young enough to base upon our future, i consider him to get the mantle from DP, who was good at both dribbling and scoring.

Now besides him, we need another thread, someone who can be as deadly Pippo/Treze was, if he can dribble too, thats ok, as this pair would be perfect, but his main attribute should be scoring a lot of goals, since we already have the creative part covered, even with a super sub like Quaq.
But one the finishing part?

So instead of bringing a finisher or just hope that Matri will score 25 goals this season and buy a better dribbler than Quaq, we got Vucinic, what exactly can Vucinic offer?

Can he score more goals than Matri, or dribble better than Quaq??
He has yet to convince at any of these two, in a period of time (3 months) that both Matri and Quaqs did...
Say what??? You talkin' bout our boy Matri being good at dribling? Dude, Matri cant run 3 feet with the ball, and if he did run more than 3 feet he would slip, fall, roll, get tackled very easily.....
 

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Badass J Elkann

It's time to go!!
Feb 12, 2006
68,902
i dont care about their techican abilities, like i never cared about Quaqs or Amauri's before him.
They are all good enough dribblers, but this is not what Juve needs.
Juve needs prolific goal scorers, we have many many alternatives from players that can dribble past defenders and create chances, our problem is that we fail to score most of those chances, and thats why i didnt want us to buy Iaq, then Amauri, then Quaq and this year Vucinic.

You guys are young and are easily sold on the spectacle and thats exactly what our management who only wants to appease the fans provide.
Dribblers to amuse the fans, but dribblers dont win the games, finishers do.
Winning with a style is the best and balanced option, but we do not have a balanced team when we already have 5 (Amauri, DP, Iaq, Quaq, Giacche) dribblers, a hybrid (Matri) and just half a true CF (Toni) and then we opt for a 6th dribbler as a starter, instead of a finisher we practically completely lack of.

Vucunic was never a prolific forward and will never become one, his strength was that he was creating chances, but so was Amauri's,
but thats not what we needed, however we never learn anything from our mistakes and keep repeating them...

Just like i said, Vucinic only came to appease the spectacle hungry masses and will offer pretty much nothing new.
IMO Quaq last year, was far better from sept-dec, as Vucinic was from Sept-Dec this year.
Overall Vucinic could be the better choice, as in his carrier he was proved to be more reliable and less injury prone than Quaq, but this will never justify the extra amount we gave and the sacrifices we made on our very limited transfer budget and real needs, to get this opportunity target, who is at best, a slight upgrade to what we already have had and was working...
(unless we were planning to sell Quaq all alone, but again we have noexcuses as we completed the tranzaction right this year and paid the extra cash to keep him)

last season you were moaning how Juve lacked creativity upfront, well vucinic sure as hell provides that. and even now you arn't satisfied, is there anyone at Juve you DO like? cause it must be painful for you to be a Juve fan, even this season.
 

Cronios

Juventolog
Jun 7, 2004
27,519
But we are playing a different system now which with the likes of tony would not be possible. I think Matri is a good buy, in the future we can look for step in quality, but in the meantime I think with him we took a good direction.
we are also (supposedly looking to build a competitive team)
We had enough depth, esp for the SS position, as we had 7 players for 2 positions and we could call even more youngsters or loaned players like Giovinco.
We had tactical needs, like LB, which were not addressed (esp after we gifted away Zeglier.)
We on earth should we priorise yet another SS over all our serious issues?? Again, for the 6th consecutive time???
Just why, give me a reason, why should we priorise a 6th SS, after spending the bulk of our transfer budget for 6 consecutive seasons, for the same position?

What future are you talking about? Do you remember the failure of the 5 year plan and ask for a new one?
When, o when, are we going to stop spending most of our budget to buy yet another SS and CM and start investing to other areas,
that we are playing with loaned players for 3-5 consecutive seasons?

What BS excuses should we invent to justify that?
Why was upgrading from Quaq to Vucinic more important than acquiring a left Licht??

And why should we buy a 6th SS, when we already have 5 and practically no finishers?

The system we are playing is not 4-3-3, as Pepe plays as a midfielder, not a forward!
even if we opt for a 4-3-3, the optimal players would be Quaq-Matri-Vucinic, but Conte obviously doesnt want that.

Neither Giacche, who is actually a SS, LM hybrid was tried in a triad. Nor DP

And thats exactly why we bought EstiG, Elia and have kept Krasic, because they are wingers.
We obviously didnt bought Vucinic to field him in a triad, because we never actually tried on the options we had.
I was hoping that we will today, as Pirlo and Krasic were out of the picture and Matri, Vucinic, Giacche, DP and Quaq were all available and fit for the game.
But Conte never considered it, so please, i dont want to hear the 4-3-3 excuse anymore, not to justify Vucinic acquisition or the future acquisition of a future Jovetic...
 

frick

Senior Member
Apr 4, 2010
4,944
Matri was never the player to score+18goals season, but he was always good at dribbling and creating chances for himself.
So he was a questionable finisher and a good dribbler, when we bought him.
Shocking.

Matri is the EXACT opposite of that. How did you open your very long post with such statement, I would never know.
 

Cronios

Juventolog
Jun 7, 2004
27,519
last season you were moaning how Juve lacked creativity upfront, well vucinic sure as hell provides that. and even now you arn't satisfied, is there anyone at Juve you DO like? cause it must be painful for you to be a Juve fan, even this season.
I never moaning about creativity, you ppl were always craving about creativity, dribbling and spectacle and i was one of the very few ones asking for finishing.
In each and every debate, my priority was always finishing and thats why i always favored the most prolific option (Dzeko to Aquero, Rossi to Cassano etc)

Dont take me wrong, i also admire Messi's flicks as any other football supporter and always admired the Brazilian jogo bonito, but this is not enough by itself to win.
We had the luxury to opt for more creativity when we had Capello and his flat 4-4-2 and 2 DMs.
But def not right after the second season we came 7th
Since calciopoli my priority has always been performance, not spectacle, we need to win first, even with ugly wins, get strong again and when we reach the top again, start worrying about winning with style.

But our new board has forfeited performance and winning and has set as a priority the spectacle.
And thats my main point of criticism against them.

Beyond any doubt, it is now obvious if you notice that the past 6 th season, we were always using most of our transfer budget on new expensive and fancy SSs and CMs, that can appease the fans by offering more spectacle.
And worry (and spend) less, on what our team really needed to become competitive again.

Esp Vucinic, after wasting so much cash for the SS the past 6 years, having so many alternative options, was yet favored above all our needs, in order to appease the fans and bring a new promising dribbler, that is impressive , but not as effective...
 

Raz

Senior Member
Nov 20, 2005
12,218
Cronios I think Matri is a ST, that's why I think we it's a good direction and so far it payed off, he is doing well, and who knows maybe he will turn out very good in the future, seing how hungry he is since he's not a kid anymore and didn't win anything.

Apart from real jump in quality we don't need to invest in any more ST or SS or whatever forward positions now we are good now. We should firstly improve our defence, and the look to our attack, since for now we have a capable attack.
 

Cronios

Juventolog
Jun 7, 2004
27,519
Shocking.

Matri is the EXACT opposite of that. How did you open your very long post with such statement, I would never know.
numbers speak for themselves, he never had a top finisher ratio before the last year and in each and every presentation, we were shown his dribbling.
What impressed of him at his very games was the dribblin, what we bought him for was the dribblin.
We sure hope that he will become a topscorer one day, but the fancy dribbling was the only thing assured.

That was the exact same thing with Amauri, i ve heard the exact same BS when we bought Amauri, but the truth is that they never had a finishers ratio, but were good ball joggler. We also hoped that he will become a top scorer, but his dribbling was assured.

This is undeniable, i can only hope that Matri is young enough to adapt in a CF role and more talented than Amauri, to actually achieve that in this level!

And again, i repeat, our options, on the SS were in abundance at any case and our only option at goal scoaring was a question mark.
Why opt for yet another SS, regardless of how you consider Matri, we already had 6 more SSs?
 

Cronios

Juventolog
Jun 7, 2004
27,519
Cronios I think Matri is a ST, that's why I think we it's a good direction and so far it payed off, he is doing well, and who knows maybe he will turn out very good in the future, seing how hungry he is since he's not a kid anymore and didn't win anything.

Apart from real jump in quality we don't need to invest in any more ST or SS or whatever forward positions now we are good now. We should firstly improve our defence, and the look to our attack, since for now we have a capable attack.
I also hope the same and he is young enough to adapt into our needs.
However i dont see him as someone who lacks technical abilities.
Actually thats what it impresses the most in this kid. He is also not a Pippo like finisher, who cannot create by himself, or dribble past his man.
Even today he has shown that at moments he was playing as LM and also has many assists and contributions as SS.

I cannot accept, at any case that such a player would be useless besides a finisher.
Why would he be? Matri would still dribble, assist and create as he does in each and every game so far!

Last year with Quaq, the last thing our forward line needed was another dribbler.
Matri and Quaq were both good at creating chances for themselves, we only had some difficulties to finish those chances.
A better finisher could do that, but a better dribbler wouldnt.
So it was a mistake to buy yet another SS imo, esp if we consider that we would have kept Amauri on the bench and Giovinco could return after DP's retirement.
Why hurry and invest on someone marginally superior to Quaq, its not like we have signed Cassano or Aquero.

Vucinic would never create so much more than Quaq to compensate our lack of finishing.
The decision to buy him, esp at the favor of our defensive needs was a mistake through and through.
It also sets a limit on our future improvement.

As we only have very limited funds, we cannot buy more than 2 new starters every year.
In Quaq we already had a decent SS, we should first upgrade the rest of our position and only replace him with a WC player in the future.
Whats the point at replacing him with Vicunic, he is not WC and will never be.
One day we will have to invest again in the SS and this day will be further extended, because we will also have the defender we didnt, in order to get him.


Thats what i mean, when i say that such transfers are pushing our plans to build a competitive team, even further, sacrificing our strategical chances,
without improving our tactical chances for the current season, as Vucinic can hardly give more than the option we already have (quaq) and the overall upgrade is still lesser, at any case, than one upgrade on the places we really hurt (LB for ex)

A left Licht, would boost our defense even more, as you can see the kind of a boost Licht gave by himself already.
Our team would be significantly stronger this season, we would have to worry about a transfer less, in our quest to have a full team of 11 competitive players.
And we wouldnt actually notice a loss on performance if Quaq was in Vucinic place, DP second and Amauri third.

But again we opted for yet another investment that gives no tactical and strategical advantage, just for the sake of adding yet a new dribbler that can appease the fans...
 

kronos

Senior Member
Aug 16, 2011
1,840
Cronios i don't really know you and it's the first time i read your posts.i might agree that we keep going for the attacking midfielders and ss instead of some other positions.BUT.how can anyone in any given situation,for any real or unreal reason, say that Matri has good dribbling and that he actually knows how to create chances for him.IMO he is a classic ST. a CENTER FORWARD you pair up with a SS in a 4-4-2 formation.he seriously has issues beating his man in a one on one situations unless he was running at him and has the advantage or speed or any other advantage for that matter. how do guys call that position? prima punta or something.that's our boy Matri right there.what the hell you going on about cronios?
 

Zé Tahir

JhoolayLaaaal!
Moderator
Dec 10, 2004
29,281
Hey Cronios, I get it. I acknowledge your concerns. Now take it easy



Alright! I heard you the first time. Argh...



Dude, what the fuck is your problem? You want a piece of this? Huh??



Aw that's it, now you're gonna get it...



Hold me back dawg, hold me back...Amma fuck this dude up



 

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