Mighty Juve Vs. Deportivo (2 Viewers)

Jun-hide

Senior Member
Dec 16, 2002
2,068
++ [ originally posted by Paolo_Montero ] ++


Well I don't know about him being less mobile than Trez. I've only seen Depor three times this year, but tristan has impressed me on each occasion. OK so he doesn't run about like a madman :D but he at least offers himself as someone to receive a pass. Trezeguet just stands there! He seems uninterested in the play until he gets the ball in the area.

You say Tristan does not have the hunger for goals but he was top scorer in Spain last year. Imagine him with Del Piero beside him, these two could rule Europe! Lets face it, without Dp, Trez is crap. He can still finish ( sometimes :rolleyes: ) but apart from that he looks totally lost. Do you honestly think Tristan would be lost? No, he has the ability to create chances for himself, go past players and put in an explosive finish!

I did not say they were in a different league to him, but they are certainly better all round players. Out of the list you made, I would certainly swap him for Sheva or raul, but Vieri is too old now to consider buying IMO. He has injury problems and that would be a burden. Henry is too weak, and cannot hold up the ball. He also misses fsr too many chances for Serie A, where the chances are more limited than the EPL.
True some of the points Paolo made is valid, and I have no objection to that.:). Hence, why said Trez has limitations.

I totally understand the frustration you get from Trez's lack of work ethic. He rarely pressurize the defence, and his movement is too predictable for a striker. Most of his runs are straight forward run to the box, and quite a lot of times simply mistimed. Also, his first touch is not the best asset in the world. Even his first touch before his goal against Depor was to agree a bit lucky.
Furthermore, he has been missing easy chances against of late.
To be honest, I have been getting frustrated myself of late, and I have been very critical of Trezeguet in recent times.;).
However, I think it is unfair on Trezeguet to get most of the blame for our current lack of penetration in attack. Our midfield, in my opinion, is more concern in my opinion. The midfield rarely gets into attack, and gives away possession far two easily.
Beside, I don't think Tristan would be better partner for Alex than Trez by any means. Yes, he does score a lot of goals, 19goals in something lack 19games he started two years ago, and the top goal scorer in la liga last year. But statistics can be damning. Firstly, la liga defence is not as good as Serie A. Secondly, Depor have likes of Valeron, Victor, Fran, and mentality which creates far more chances than we do. Thirdly, Trezeguet did not take a single penalty last year and yet to scored 24goals in Serie A is quite unbelievable.
Furthermore, Tristan has been very poor for Spain when he partnered Raul who can be considered as a simiilar clone to Del Piero. I think one of the reason is that both Tristan and Raul demands the ball unlike Morientes, who tends to be off-the-ball movement player. Trezeguet, though, I admit his movement isn't that good nor any better than Tristan, does not demand the ball, and is quite happy to be a "off the ball" player.

I have to say both Makaay and Tristan is outstanding player their own right.:). And their presence would be welcomed by any team.:), However, I don't think it is guaranteed that they will both do that much better than Trezeguet at his very best. They might and might not, but I don't think there is enough evidence to suggest that they will form better partnership wtih Alex. Makaay has pace, power, finishing skill, while Tristan display far higher degree of technical ability than Trez. Nevertheless, I think Trez is a better goal scorer than both, be it by the help of our mercurial captain, and as a partner they aren't many better than Alex and Trez.
 

Hydde

Minimiliano Tristelli
Mar 6, 2003
38,735
You have a point,,,those two together are vry dangerous.
We must wait delpiro´s comeback people,,,and after 5 or 6 game , we can talk about this again, cuz last year, when trez was scoeing like crazy, no one was thinking that he was crap. lets wait .
 

denco

Superior Being
Jul 12, 2002
4,679
I have said it before and i will say it again, Tristan alongside Kluivert are the best target men in the business

Tristan is just a marvellous footballer and he does score a lot of goals as well sometimes outta nothing

Jun , you say la liga is easier to score in than Serie a, that might be true but he has scored 3 times against Juve, once or twice against Milan and thats not a bad record against Serie A sides

I think he and Dp will make a good combo as they are both skilful and should develop a good understanding as they should be on the same wavelength

Its not easy to develop a good understanding in the Nt as you play so infrequently and not a lot of players take to Nt fotball straight away

Trez if not for his silly ego will imo make the best supersub in the world as he can come on and score goals as he does not need that much time to warm up to score as he does nothing apart from score anyway

You see, everyone can see now that if he is not scoring then he is of little use to his side as he does not disturb defenders with his off the ball running ot closing them down or holding up the ball and bringing his midfielders into play

If only he can accept being on the bench and coming on to score crucial goals but i doubt that will ever happen

I personally think its ridiculous for him to be totally dependent on another player say Dp for his scoring to be good, ppl say he is not on good form, thats not true, he always plays like this and the thing which disguised it last season is his goals

It would have been if we had players who can hold the ball but we do not and so it shows so obviously that with Trez, we usually play with 10 men and his goals
 

Jun-hide

Senior Member
Dec 16, 2002
2,068
++ [ originally posted by denco ] ++
I have said it before and i will say it again, Tristan alongside Kluivert are the best target men in the business

Tristan is just a marvellous footballer and he does score a lot of goals as well sometimes outta nothing

Jun , you say la liga is easier to score in than Serie a, that might be true but he has scored 3 times against Juve, once or twice against Milan and thats not a bad record against Serie A sides

I think he and Dp will make a good combo as they are both skilful and should develop a good understanding as they should be on the same wavelength

Its not easy to develop a good understanding in the Nt as you play so infrequently and not a lot of players take to Nt fotball straight away

Trez if not for his silly ego will imo make the best supersub in the world as he can come on and score goals as he does not need that much time to warm up to score as he does nothing apart from score anyway

You see, everyone can see now that if he is not scoring then he is of little use to his side as he does not disturb defenders with his off the ball running ot closing them down or holding up the ball and bringing his midfielders into play

If only he can accept being on the bench and coming on to score crucial goals but i doubt that will ever happen

I personally think its ridiculous for him to be totally dependent on another player say Dp for his scoring to be good, ppl say he is not on good form, thats not true, he always plays like this and the thing which disguised it last season is his goals

It would have been if we had players who can hold the ball but we do not and so it shows so obviously that with Trez, we usually play with 10 men and his goals
I see your points Denco, and I do agree with some of them.:).
Although, I am not sure on Tristan being the best target man in the world, as a lone forward he is far superior than Trezeguet. He holds the ball better, and also allows the midfield to join him in the attack, which Trez fails to do miserably. However, I am not sure as a partner for Alex. Firstly, I think Spanish liga tends to inflate the no. of goals scored and also I don't think couple of games in Europe is a good indication of adaptability in Serie A.
For example, even "mediocre" Javi Moreno managed to score over 20goals in one season in la liga. Besides, there have been cases whereby La Liga player completely outplayed Serie A opposition and yet failed to make such impact after the transition. Mendieta, Contra, Javi Moreno, Rivaldo, Farinos, and to certain degree Ivan Heguera, Roberto Ayala, comes into my mind. Most of these players are great players and because they weren't successful in Serie A doesn't make bad players but my point is La liga players have shown in the past that they are terrible at adjusting to Serie A. Claudio Lopez is only player I can think of that has made adjustment relatively well, and yet he struggle early on, eventhough it was mainly due to the injury.
I am not saying that Tristan would not succeed in Serie A. After all, he is one heck of a player. Fantastic technique for a player of his size, and very goal scoring record makes him a desirable player for any team:). However, I am just not convinced that he would definetly form better partnership with Alex, and Trezeguet despite his faults does do one thing very well when he plays alongside Alex, and that is to score goals.:). Why change the formular which is working for you? I would only consider changing when the talent gulf is too big to ignore like Vieri, Raul, Sheva, and Henry but not Tristan. However, this doesn't mean Tristan is worse player than Trez. It is just that I would be scared to change the system unless a incredible money or talent which is far above is thrown at me.
:)
 

denco

Superior Being
Jul 12, 2002
4,679
Jun, okay please name me a better target man than Tristan when Tristan is on form, certainly not Carew and the only one whom is as good in my eyes is Kluivert

You mention all those players who have flopped in Italy, well lets see, noone had ever heard of Moreno till he scored all those goals for Alaves and Milan bought him, hardly played him and when they did, he was short of confidence , he might have been a one season wonder , we do not know as he is hardly in Athletico Madrid's side now is he?

Mendietta , came with a gr8 reputation but I did actually see his decline the season before for Valencia as he was not as good as he was the previous 2 seasons, but i digress, he comes to Lazio and is placed in the hands of Zaccaheroni who plays the most boring football this side of Howard Wilkinson, plays him completely out of position and then drops him to the bench, and kills the guy's confidence, he is at Barcelona now and he is still a shadow of the player he once was

Contra did have some good games for Milan but again they did not play him where he is good, they played him as a midfileder which he was always protesting he aint

If you took Vieri to Spain and started playing as a midfielder , what do u think will happen

The good thing about Spanish football is that they play the game simply, and each player plays in a position he is good at while in Italy they spend money on stars and try to accommodate them in positions where they are not used to like some examples I have mentioned above and so many more

You watch Valencia or Depor and they do niot have many stars but the left back is a natural left back, the right back is a natural right back all the way down to the centre forward

Juve have a right footed left back, a right sided midfielder playing left back, a striker playing on the left wing, a pure finisher asked to play as a lone striker why won't our play be incoherent
 

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