Untrainable and just not good enough aren't necessarily the same thing though.
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Massimiliano Allegri (205 Viewers)
- Thread starter Mark
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Juve pretty much midway through season and are struggling to stay midtable. Defeats against small teams and some good old fashioned humiliations along the way.
I'd say that lavels him a failure already. We don't let players like Alex sandro off hook cuz he was good in 2016. Why do we let allegri go? Cuz fans desperate that's why.
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I'd say that lavels him a failure already. We don't let players like Alex sandro off hook cuz he was good in 2016. Why do we let allegri go? Cuz fans desperate that's why.
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Yep. All one has to do is look at Klopp’s first two seasons at Pool. 8th place, 4th place and a lot of really poor performances. Doesn’t make him a bad coach. He’s a great coach. And he has built a great team, but with a blank check and turnover of basically the entire roster in his first three years there. He was supported through a couple bad years and rewarded that by building them into an elite team again.
Right now we have last season’s 4th place, 78 point team minus Ronaldo. Plus Locatelli. Or we could also say we have Sarri’s 83 pt scudetto team minus Ronaldo, Pjanic, Matuidi, Khedira, Demiral, plus Chiesa and Locatelli. Were the three midfielders at the end of their useful Juve careers, yes. Does that mean we adequately replaced them with same level or better than what they were that year. Not even close. We don’t have Ronaldo to bail us out with his 30+ goals a season, and we’re seeing what that means right now.
Regardless of thoughts on Allegri, we’re in for a transition period. And it may get worse before it gets better with Chiellini retiring, Bonucci and Cuadrado getting up there in years. We need a top coach, Max or another, doesn’t matter who (top coach doesn’t mean a Pirlo though lol) and the club needs to hunker down and support him for a couple transfer windows and if he fails to improve and build a competitive team sack him then. You don’t bring top level coaches and sack them a single year into rebuilding a team.
Right now we have last season’s 4th place, 78 point team minus Ronaldo. Plus Locatelli. Or we could also say we have Sarri’s 83 pt scudetto team minus Ronaldo, Pjanic, Matuidi, Khedira, Demiral, plus Chiesa and Locatelli. Were the three midfielders at the end of their useful Juve careers, yes. Does that mean we adequately replaced them with same level or better than what they were that year. Not even close. We don’t have Ronaldo to bail us out with his 30+ goals a season, and we’re seeing what that means right now.
Regardless of thoughts on Allegri, we’re in for a transition period. And it may get worse before it gets better with Chiellini retiring, Bonucci and Cuadrado getting up there in years. We need a top coach, Max or another, doesn’t matter who (top coach doesn’t mean a Pirlo though lol) and the club needs to hunker down and support him for a couple transfer windows and if he fails to improve and build a competitive team sack him then. You don’t bring top level coaches and sack them a single year into rebuilding a team.
What transition period that lasted 4 years? We were still trying to win with our veterans until last season. We just cleared out the likes of Mandzukic, Khedira, Pjanic, Matuidi, Higuain, Ronaldo, Etc over the last two seasons. Our transition has hardly begun, and begun poorly because Tootsie outside a few purchases did a shit job.
Has Allegri done a good job thus far? Not in the slightest. Is our squad currently elite and full of top players? Also not in the slightest. It’s full of lazy, overrated players who need to be sent packing. If Allegri gets fired because we have a truly awful season, so be it. He’ll deserve it. But the next coach, whoever that may be, will inherit this same mess and our transition will continue. Management has to build a cohesive, hardworking, talented young squad over the next couple summers.
Has Allegri done a good job thus far? Not in the slightest. Is our squad currently elite and full of top players? Also not in the slightest. It’s full of lazy, overrated players who need to be sent packing. If Allegri gets fired because we have a truly awful season, so be it. He’ll deserve it. But the next coach, whoever that may be, will inherit this same mess and our transition will continue. Management has to build a cohesive, hardworking, talented young squad over the next couple summers.
I think by now it's clear that he won't meet the expectation of winning Serie A that most of us understood as the metric for success. We are also far from challenging for the league title.
So now the expectation has dropped to top 4 finish and even that seems uncertain. Folks are making comparisons to Klopp taking a few years to build the winning team. For starters, Klopp inherited a team that hasnt touched a trophy in a decade, and was competing against multiple teams that were spending crazy money every year. He didn't inherit the league's richest team, and his competitors didn't have to do a sell-off of their coach and key players.
But more importantly, Klopp from his first season imposed an identity and specific game plan and built around that. He has a philosophy, a style of play that was visible. You could see the players getting used to it more and more, there was progress on the pitch, players improved and then he added players to the team that fit this style of play.
We see none of that with Allegri thus far. This season is more like Ole's season this year, and less like Klopp or Pep's first season. We still don't know what his idea is football is. We are not seeing any emerging patterns of play. Changing players and formations over and over. The only constant is chaos. Players that just had a beastly Euro have turned to shit. Players that had a good season under Pirlo (Ronaldo aside) have regressed. Morata, Chiesa, Cuadrado. Mckennie, Kulusevsk, De Ligt.. heck even Rabiot is worse this year than he was last season.
The Klopp comparison is invalid. He wouldnt have kept his job if his team looked even more clueless, playing uglier football with worse results than his predecessor at the end of his first season. We are only ~halfway through the season, Allegri still has time to at least show some signs of progress. But the clock is ticking.
So now the expectation has dropped to top 4 finish and even that seems uncertain. Folks are making comparisons to Klopp taking a few years to build the winning team. For starters, Klopp inherited a team that hasnt touched a trophy in a decade, and was competing against multiple teams that were spending crazy money every year. He didn't inherit the league's richest team, and his competitors didn't have to do a sell-off of their coach and key players.
But more importantly, Klopp from his first season imposed an identity and specific game plan and built around that. He has a philosophy, a style of play that was visible. You could see the players getting used to it more and more, there was progress on the pitch, players improved and then he added players to the team that fit this style of play.
We see none of that with Allegri thus far. This season is more like Ole's season this year, and less like Klopp or Pep's first season. We still don't know what his idea is football is. We are not seeing any emerging patterns of play. Changing players and formations over and over. The only constant is chaos. Players that just had a beastly Euro have turned to shit. Players that had a good season under Pirlo (Ronaldo aside) have regressed. Morata, Chiesa, Cuadrado. Mckennie, Kulusevsk, De Ligt.. heck even Rabiot is worse this year than he was last season.
The Klopp comparison is invalid. He wouldnt have kept his job if his team looked even more clueless, playing uglier football with worse results than his predecessor at the end of his first season. We are only ~halfway through the season, Allegri still has time to at least show some signs of progress. But the clock is ticking.
Sad but true. This is more and more looking like Ole's season so far but if anyone deserves the benefit of the doubt, it's Allegri.
There's simply no point changing coaches every single year. If we gave the winemaker one whole season, might as well give Allegri an extra year even if we don't make CL and see where we go from there.
The bigger problem of this club is the decision making from the upper management. Agnelli and his cronies have been sabotaging this club with their terrible decisions both on and off the pitch which as a result, is creating a toxic atmosphere within the club.
We need a Beppe type guy to clean the mess here. I trust Allegri as a coach but I don't trust his transfer market decisions. Bring in a competent DS asap.
There's simply no point changing coaches every single year. If we gave the winemaker one whole season, might as well give Allegri an extra year even if we don't make CL and see where we go from there.
The bigger problem of this club is the decision making from the upper management. Agnelli and his cronies have been sabotaging this club with their terrible decisions both on and off the pitch which as a result, is creating a toxic atmosphere within the club.
We need a Beppe type guy to clean the mess here. I trust Allegri as a coach but I don't trust his transfer market decisions. Bring in a competent DS asap.
We honestly need 6 new starters to compete for anything and I'd say some of our starters aren't even fit to have important bench roles they're so fucking inept
Sure Allegri hasn't done much since our park the bus streak ended but I don't see any manager getting us beyond 4th. We destroyed everything good about this team year after year.
Sure Allegri hasn't done much since our park the bus streak ended but I don't see any manager getting us beyond 4th. We destroyed everything good about this team year after year.