Kiev crisis / Euromaidan (38 Viewers)

[Trequartista]

Once again. This isn't an official war zone and all airlines were still using this route as it is one of the most attended air routes between Europe and Asia. This stopped now of course.

I see, thanks

 

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[IliveForJuve]

Wow, I hope these bastard Russian insurgents get raped by a Mandingo tribe.

 

[Mister]

French Foreign Minister Laurent Fabius says "at least" four French nationals were on board the flight, AFP reports

 

[Maddy]

US citizens wern't killed in the cuba missile crisis, which is what you appear to alluding to. The two aren't comparable in the slightest.

What? No. Cuba was in regards to history a bad example. Let's say Nicaragua instead.

The US have very few options besides economic sanctions in this crisis/conflict.

 

[swag]

Pretty sure The Netherlands will invade eastern Ukraine now.

It would have been easier for Ajax to agree to a transfer fee for Bernard.

This is so fucked, Reuters are claiming that there were 23 US citizens on board, shit will hit the fan is that is accurate,

Reminds me a little of when the Russians shot down the Koreans.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_Air_Lines_Flight_007

 

[Bjerknes]

Why would a commercial airline even risk flying over a region where there is an armed conflict and where an Ukrainian jet was shot down only yesterday?

It doesn't make sense at all.

It seems like the flight was off the normal flight routes through Eastern Ukraine, possibly around 100 KM North of the usual path. Looking at the weather conditions in the area, there were thunderstorms over the section of Ukraine where the jets would normally travel. Therefore, it might be plausible to say that the pilots took more Northerly route to avoid the storms, which then caused those in charge of the missiles to fire. It could have been a situation such as that, but it still does not explain why they would fire upon an unknown target.

Seems like the Ukraine government and separatists are going to fight over who investigates the crash sites.

The Ukrainian military could have accidently shot it down as well, who knows.

 

[Ford Prefect]

What? No. Cuba was in regards to history a bad example. Let's say Nicaragua instead.

The US have very few options besides economic sanctions in this crisis/conflict.

The perspective I am seeing this from is: either the Ukrainian Separatists are part of a country 'East Ukraine' and they have just commited a war crime, or the Ukrainian Separatists are insurgents who have just committed an international act of terror. This affects countries around the world and is being viewed live by the world. You may well find that Putin's and Obama's hands are forced by the international reaction.

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It would have been easier for Ajax to agree to a transfer fee for Bernard.



Reminds me a little of when the Russians shot down the Koreans.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_Air_Lines_Flight_007

Reminds me a bit of the Lockerbie Bombing: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pan_Am_Flight_103

 

[Mister]

Flight recorders have been found at the crash site, Konstantin Knyrik, a spokesman for the pro-Russian rebels, has told Interfax news agency. Earlier reports quoted rebels as saying they intended to send the flight recorders to Moscow for checking.

 

[Bjerknes]

Aviation expert on CNN saying that there was no smoke trail from missile impact zone to ground crash site. This means that most likely this is NOT a missile impact situation. Even if the missile did not directly impact the plane, there would still be explosions due to pressure losses in the aircraft.

When he said that, the regular CNN experts looked aggitated.

The dude raises a GREAT point.

 

[radekas]

Flight recorders have been found at the crash site, Konstantin Knyrik, a spokesman for the pro-Russian rebels, has told Interfax news agency. Earlier reports quoted rebels as saying they intended to send the flight recorders to Moscow for checking.

Well there goes any chance of real investigation.

 

[Ford Prefect]

Aviation expert on CNN saying that there was no smoke trail from missile impact zone to ground crash site. This means that most likely this is NOT a missile impact situation. Even if the missile did not directly impact the plane, there would still be explosions due to pressure losses in the aircraft.

When he said that, the regular CNN experts looked aggitated.

The dude raises a GREAT point.

The implication being that it was a bomb on board?

 

[Bjerknes]

Well there goes any chance of real investigation.

They don't need the black box to confirm a missile hit.

 

[swag]

Reminds me a bit of the Lockerbie Bombing: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pan_Am_Flight_103

The implication being that it was a bomb on board?

Would be odd why they chose to detonate only over the Eastern Ukraine, however. Especially if the plane avoided the normal flight path due to weather.

 

[Bjerknes]

The implication being that it was a bomb on board?

If there was a bomb on board it would have caused an explosion and subsequent smoke trail, so no.

If so, then that would point to a hijacking or something else.

They didn't let him explain himself much further, unfortunately.

 

[radekas]

They don't need the black box to confirm a missile hit.

True but this gives the Russians all the chances to manipulate the evidence. The MAK commission is a mouthpiece of Kremlin and their investigation will give any results Putin wants. Hopefully some other evidence can be decisive though.

 

[Mister]

They don't need the black box to confirm a missile hit.

Satellite data can show a missile hit no ?

 

[Bjerknes]

•Putin’s plane may have been target of Ukrainian rocket: Interfax
◦Russian President Vladimir Putin’s plane crossed route of crashed Malaysian plane near Warsaw, Interfax reports, citing unidentified person in Russian aviation service.
◦Possible that Ukrainian rocket was fired from land or from military plane: Interfax cites source
◦Plane that crashed was similar in size, color: Interfax
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-07-17/ukraine-rebels-find-black-box-full-mh-17-update

 

[radekas]

•Putin’s plane may have been target of Ukrainian rocket: Interfax
◦Russian President Vladimir Putin’s plane crossed route of crashed Malaysian plane near Warsaw, Interfax reports, citing unidentified person in Russian aviation service.
◦Possible that Ukrainian rocket was fired from land or from military plane: Interfax cites source
◦Plane that crashed was similar in size, color: Interfax
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-07-17/ukraine-rebels-find-black-box-full-mh-17-update

Warsaw is only 1000km away after all.

 

[Bjerknes]

Satellite data can show a missile hit no ?

Yep, along with radar data.

Plenty of that in Eastern Europe.

I'm sure the intelligence agencies already know the culprits if it was indeed shot down. They can easily pinpoint where it originated from and compare it to troop movements.

 

[Mister]

Screenshot of the rebel post claiming a cargo plane shootdown. He even posted a photo of the smoke plume which matches the current crash site imagery .