J Stadium/Allianz (39 Viewers)

Joe

Joe

Senior Member
#2,262
Dec 20, 2009
14,980
#2,262
Nenna said:
So you've based your opinion on the entirety of Italy based on Torino. Whether we have a strong Italian past or not, its ludicrous that we even dare to present ourselves with the tri-colours even more then we even do with the bianconero. Its fucking unacceptable for any club in the world to put their country before their team.
Bianconero_Aus how Italian are you? Were you even born in Italy? What brings about this Italian nationalist sentiment? You are living in Australia mate so don't go whinging when people criticise the FIGC (who are systematically killing Italian football with their nationalist approach to club football), the Italian government which is among the most terrible least organised governments I've come across out of all the european countries I've lived in. Italy is wayyy behind the likes of France, Spain, Germany and Britain. Berlusconi has made racism and sexism the norm in Italy, he's driven up unemployment and driven out most of the Italian youth to Britain and Germany. Under the current Italian government the future of Italy seems very very bleak. So don't get all high and mighty about Italian institutions because Italy is inherently flawed in a variety of ways. I think you need to quit waving your Italian flag and get real.
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I'm not getting angry at people disagreeing with the Italian colours being on the stadium. But I do disagree when you say parts of northern Italy don't take pride in being Italian. Maybe you met the minority.

electricRoo said:
Italian is not a race, it's a nationality. The negative sentiment is brought by us going after italians despite this generation being subpar, and we are not even going after the best of the subpar elements that are available (Balotelli, Cassano). It's because Juve puts nationality ahead of their own well being, nothing more, there's nothing "racist" or xenophobic against Italy or Italians.

Hell, like I mentioned, they have their own issues to deal with themselves, Italians are some of the most xenophobic and racist peoples in Europe.
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Why don't you just generalize a bit more?
 
JuveJay

JuveJay

Senior Signor
Moderator
#2,264
Mar 6, 2007
74,922
#2,264
electricRoo said:
Italian is not a race, it's a nationality. The negative sentiment is brought by us going after italians despite this generation being subpar, and we are not even going after the best of the subpar elements that are available (Balotelli, Cassano). It's because Juve puts nationality ahead of their own well being, nothing more, there's nothing "racist" or xenophobic against Italy or Italians.

Hell, like I mentioned, they have their own issues to deal with themselves, Italians are some of the most xenophobic and racist peoples in Europe.
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I didn't say otherwise, see my first sentence. And yes, it has crossed over several times to xenophobic response based on frustration due to the calibre of players we have signed, but you've not been around too long to see it. When it gets to the point where you are dismissing a nationality of players en masse to contest a perceived favouritism of this same nationality (happens a lot with different topics), as seems to pop up now and again, then I think the point is being missed. It's just about trying to get good players to fit into an effective team. Marotta went one way this year, it hasn't worked and hasn't battled through tough periods. Marotta didn't create this idea, he took it on and ran with it, then fell over :D

As for the last comment, I think you'll find cultures that are more mixed ethnically just disguise their racism better. Some of the most racist people I have encountered in the UK are the ethnic minorities, towards each other. In Italy it's more open, like Britain was 30 years ago. Political correctness will set in only when the country's politics aren't run by right wing lunatics.
 
Bianconero_Aus

Bianconero_Aus

Beppe Marotta Is My God
#2,268
May 26, 2009
80,957
#2,268
Nenna said:
So you've based your opinion on the entirety of Italy based on Torino. Whether we have a strong Italian past or not, its ludicrous that we even dare to present ourselves with the tri-colours even more then we even do with the bianconero. Its fucking unacceptable for any club in the world to put their country before their team.
Bianconero_Aus how Italian are you? Were you even born in Italy? What brings about this Italian nationalist sentiment? You are living in Australia mate so don't go whinging when people criticise the FIGC (who are systematically killing Italian football with their nationalist approach to club football), the Italian government which is among the most terrible least organised governments I've come across out of all the european countries I've lived in. Italy is wayyy behind the likes of France, Spain, Germany and Britain. Berlusconi has made racism and sexism the norm in Italy, he's driven up unemployment and driven out most of the Italian youth to Britain and Germany. Under the current Italian government the future of Italy seems very very bleak. So don't get all high and mighty about Italian institutions because Italy is inherently flawed in a variety of ways. I think you need to quit waving your Italian flag and get real.
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Err, first of all Juve is BASED IN TORINO, so of course I am going to base my arguement on the fact that the people of Torino are proud to be Italian and probably wont have that much of a problem with Juve using those colours prominently. And where did I say it wasn't right for those on this forum to criticise the FIGC and Italian governement? Perhaps reading and comprehension aren't your strong suits buddy.

The majority of Italian youth move to Britain and Germany etc? Really? Provide some figures mate, because that sounds like absolute rubbish. Yes, Im sure there is quite a few Italians who move abroad for better work/study opportunities but not as many as you suggest. And, if anything Italy is now a country that receives immigrants as opposed to a country of emigres (large scale anyway). I think there are big social, political and financial problems all over Europe not just in Italy and yes I have lived there mate and have relatives all over the country. Perhaps you shouldnt get all "high and mighty" too sunshine.

And why should Juve give a fuck what other clubs in other countries in the world do? If they feel the need to promote the tricolore and their history as the main breeding ground for the Azzurri, so be it. Barca (even though I despise them) do a very similar thing with regards to their whole Catalan image (even though its a bit of a different circumstance). Also a few of the Basque clubs in Spain have very similiar nationalistic/regional policies that the fans of those particular clubs are proud of.

PS I never said I prefered the tricolori over the bianconeri colours. Once again reading and comprehension fail. Ive noticed this with Melbournians, you're all fucking weird :)
 
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