[ITA] Serie A 2015/2016 (47 Viewers)
- Thread starter Dostoevsky
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Whoscored doesn't show where he played those minutes. Btw transfer market gives him 32 games 11 goals and 8 assists (3 more than on Whoscored). If you did not give me all his games and only focused on 29 out of 31 starting appearances, how is it that you have him 5 assists more than his season total on whoscored and 2 more than his season total on tranfermrkt?
Similarly, if he had 11 goals in 32 games on transfermrkt, how did you get two more goals in 29 games? This data is fucked.
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Patriotism again
He is saying a non-juve player might be better at something than a juve player. He should be tried for treason. You should never defend him even if you agree with what he is saying.
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Only these stats turned out to be false and if they were true, would only show that they are equals. Mind you Cuadrado never came close to that kind of form again since then and is now 27 while Salah is 22/23. Also Salah still has the rest of the season to go and so should probably score and assist more.
Moreover, you are the one that brought in defensive categories not me. I was comparing him in 2013/14 with Salah today and not when he is WB at Juve. These stats were yours.
Similarly, if he had 11 goals in 32 games on transfermrkt, how did you get two more goals in 29 games? This data is fucked.
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Patriotism again
He is saying a non-juve player might be better at something than a juve player. He should be tried for treason. You should never defend him even if you agree with what he is saying.
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Actual discussion? I pointed out that he was trying to suggest a WB was comparable to a winger. Which is ridiculous. And that comparing exclusively goals and assists, especially between 2 players who play vastly different roles is something he attacks in others.
He outright admits that he hates Cuadrado and tries to suggest he is remaining non-biased.
And Zizinho is right with his comparison because he was counting European games from the seasons in question.
Not to mention Cuadrado did not start 31 matches in Serie A for Viola as an attacker in 13/14, he started 24 of them as an attacker, and in those 24 matches had 11 goals-4 assists, which is identical to what Salah has done in 22 starts as an attacker in Serie A for Roma this year. Including in terms of goals+assists per minute.
It's quite obvious Cuadrado is a far superior all-around player. Every shred of evidence points to that. And the only evidence we have of attacking prowess as an outright winger points to very equivalent output from the 2 players. Hence Cuadrado = Salah in attack, but Cuadrado > Salah in all other aspects of the game.
Only someone who has repeatedly stated how he hates Cuadrado would fail to see this.
He outright admits that he hates Cuadrado and tries to suggest he is remaining non-biased.
And Zizinho is right with his comparison because he was counting European games from the seasons in question.
Not to mention Cuadrado did not start 31 matches in Serie A for Viola as an attacker in 13/14, he started 24 of them as an attacker, and in those 24 matches had 11 goals-4 assists, which is identical to what Salah has done in 22 starts as an attacker in Serie A for Roma this year. Including in terms of goals+assists per minute.
It's quite obvious Cuadrado is a far superior all-around player. Every shred of evidence points to that. And the only evidence we have of attacking prowess as an outright winger points to very equivalent output from the 2 players. Hence Cuadrado = Salah in attack, but Cuadrado > Salah in all other aspects of the game.
Only someone who has repeatedly stated how he hates Cuadrado would fail to see this.
Moreover, you are the one that brought in defensive categories not me. I was comparing him in 2013/14 with Salah today and not when he is WB at Juve. These stats were yours.
So? Thats even more reason to consider Serie A games and not Europa League. Cuad was a WB according to you when we are comparing wingers + Salah doesnt play in the Europa.
Also Higuain has been scoring in 2 consecutive big games now. What a legend
Also Higuain has been scoring in 2 consecutive big games now. What a legend
Cuadrado 24 games on "offensive positions" (RW, LW, AM, SS, CF) - 11 goals, 7 assists - playing for an inferior offensive team (65 goals for the entire 13/14 season)
Salah 24 games on "offensive positions" this season - 11 goals, 5 assists - playing for a superior offensive team (59 goals already this season)
Cuadrado > Salah as an offensive player
Back to 7 assists I see. On who scored the season total assists is 5 man. Same on ESPN. Transfermkt is full of shit apparently. The conclusion we can get here is that Cuadrado from 2013/14 was almost as effective as Salah was.
Now Cuadrado is nowhere near that level now and has not been anywhere close ever since. Salah is at that level now and has 10 more games in the season to do better than Cuadrado. Salah is also 5 years younger. This is his first full year playing top level football. He had a great run with viola last season 6 goals and 3 assists in 16 games.
We will see over the next few years whether Cuadrado will ever get his level back and how good Salah will turn out to be.
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Back to 7 assists I see. On who scored the season total assists is 5 man. Same on ESPN. Transfermkt is full of shit apparently. The conclusion we can get here is that Cuadrado from 2013/14 was almost as effective as Salah was.
Now Cuadrado is nowhere near that level now and has not been anywhere close ever since. Salah is at that level now and has 10 more games in the season to do better than Cuadrado. Salah is also 5 years younger. This is his first full year playing top level football. He had a great run with viola last season 6 goals and 3 assists in 16 games.
We will see over the next few years whether Cuadrado will ever get his level back and how good Salah will turn out to be.
Back to 7 assists I see. On who scored the season total assists is 5 man. Same on ESPN. Transfermkt is full of $#@! apparently. The conclusion we can get here is that Cuadrado from 2013/14 was almost as effective as Salah was.
Now Cuadrado is nowhere near that level now and has not been anywhere close ever since. Salah is at that level now and has 10 more games in the season to do better than Cuadrado. Salah is also 5 years younger. This is his first full year playing top level football. He had a great run with viola last season 6 goals and 3 assists in 16 games.
We will see over the next few years whether Cuadrado will ever get his level back and how good Salah will turn out to be.
full of bullshit like i said. can you even read? 11+7=18 11+5=16, 18>16. trust me, i double checked on that.how do you know hes nowhere near that level when we havent had enough games of him in more advanced positions to judge from. you yourself said we should compare this salah to 13-14 cuadrado, because thats the last time he actually played constantly in more advanced positions. and cuadrado played for an inferior offensive team compared to this roma which you also ignore + cuadrado is more of a classic winger because he rarely cuts inside to shoot and rarely moves into goalscoring areas because his 1st instinct is to go wide most of the time. yet he still outnumbers salahs best season when playing more offensively in same number of games. if salah gets more goals or assists, which he probably will, we will have to count their goals/assists per game ratio. why? for another reason you constantly ignore because otherwise you wouldnt be able to bullshit around - they are on the same number of games that can be taken as example here, as clearly seen in my post above. so if salah gets more goals and assists it will not necessarily mean he has a more effective season. age doesent matter at all, nor does how many seasons at top level he has. you said he was a better offensive player, which was proven to be wrong.
what happens in next few years is also irrelevant
@zizinho I did not say he has more than 3 as per the above quote. You are being misleading here.
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Can you get the number of minutes he played in the games where he was RW?
And if Salah scores or assists more till the end of the season then it is an indicator of his effectiveness. A ratio of goals and assists/ minutes where that is spread over 40 games is better than when its over 30 or 20. A clear example would be starting one match and scoring which would give an incredible rate. If a player can keep scoring and assisting at the same rate for a prolonged period is better than one who does not. a guy who scores 25 goals in 50 games is better than one who scores 10 in 20 games. This is because displaying continuity demonstrates possessing the ability (that its not a lucky streak or an anomaly). Zaza's ratio for instance will sharply worsen if he starts 50 games for us.
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yeah, obviously. because i did only serie a this time like you asked, the numbers (for both players) would be lower. Salah back to 5 assists if you havent noticed. also, on whoscored salah is on 3 assists but you will ofcourse ignore that. almost as effective full of bull$#@! like i said. can you even read? 11+7=18 11+5=16, 18>16. trust me, i double checked on that.
how do you know hes nowhere near that level when we havent had enough games of him in more advanced positions to judge from. you yourself said we should compare this salah to 13-14 cuadrado, because thats the last time he actually played constantly in more advanced positions. and cuadrado played for an inferior offensive team compared to this roma which you also ignore + cuadrado is more of a classic winger because he rarely cuts inside to shoot and rarely moves into goalscoring areas because his 1st instinct is to go wide most of the time. yet he still outnumbers salahs best season when playing more offensively in same number of games. if salah gets more goals or assists, which he probably will, we will have to count their goals/assists per game ratio. why? for another reason you constantly ignore because otherwise you wouldnt be able to bull$#@! around - they are on the same number of games that can be taken as example here, as clearly seen in my post above. so if salah gets more goals and assists it will not necessarily mean he has a more effective season. age doesent matter at all, nor does how many seasons at top level he has. you said he was a better offensive player, which was proven to be wrong.
what happens in next few years is also irrelevant
full of bull$#@! like i said. can you even read? 11+7=18 11+5=16, 18>16. trust me, i double checked on that.how do you know hes nowhere near that level when we havent had enough games of him in more advanced positions to judge from. you yourself said we should compare this salah to 13-14 cuadrado, because thats the last time he actually played constantly in more advanced positions. and cuadrado played for an inferior offensive team compared to this roma which you also ignore + cuadrado is more of a classic winger because he rarely cuts inside to shoot and rarely moves into goalscoring areas because his 1st instinct is to go wide most of the time. yet he still outnumbers salahs best season when playing more offensively in same number of games. if salah gets more goals or assists, which he probably will, we will have to count their goals/assists per game ratio. why? for another reason you constantly ignore because otherwise you wouldnt be able to bull$#@! around - they are on the same number of games that can be taken as example here, as clearly seen in my post above. so if salah gets more goals and assists it will not necessarily mean he has a more effective season. age doesent matter at all, nor does how many seasons at top level he has. you said he was a better offensive player, which was proven to be wrong.
what happens in next few years is also irrelevant
Can you get the number of minutes he played in the games where he was RW?
And if Salah scores or assists more till the end of the season then it is an indicator of his effectiveness. A ratio of goals and assists/ minutes where that is spread over 40 games is better than when its over 30 or 20. A clear example would be starting one match and scoring which would give an incredible rate. If a player can keep scoring and assisting at the same rate for a prolonged period is better than one who does not. a guy who scores 25 goals in 50 games is better than one who scores 10 in 20 games. This is because displaying continuity demonstrates possessing the ability (that its not a lucky streak or an anomaly). Zaza's ratio for instance will sharply worsen if he starts 50 games for us.
yeah, obviously. because i did only serie a this time like you asked, the numbers (for both players) would be lower. Salah back to 5 assists if you havent noticed. also, on whoscored salah is on 3 assists but you will ofcourse ignore that. almost as effective full of bullshit like i said. can you even read? 11+7=18 11+5=16, 18>16. trust me, i double checked on that.
how do you know hes nowhere near that level when we havent had enough games of him in more advanced positions to judge from. you yourself said we should compare this salah to 13-14 cuadrado, because thats the last time he actually played constantly in more advanced positions. and cuadrado played for an inferior offensive team compared to this roma which you also ignore + cuadrado is more of a classic winger because he rarely cuts inside to shoot and rarely moves into goalscoring areas because his 1st instinct is to go wide most of the time. yet he still outnumbers salahs best season when playing more offensively in same number of games. if salah gets more goals or assists, which he probably will, we will have to count their goals/assists per game ratio. why? for another reason you constantly ignore because otherwise you wouldnt be able to bullshit around - they are on the same number of games that can be taken as example here, as clearly seen in my post above. so if salah gets more goals and assists it will not necessarily mean he has a more effective season. age doesent matter at all, nor does how many seasons at top level he has. you said he was a better offensive player, which was proven to be wrong.
what happens in next few years is also irrelevant
full of bullshit like i said. can you even read? 11+7=18 11+5=16, 18>16. trust me, i double checked on that.how do you know hes nowhere near that level when we havent had enough games of him in more advanced positions to judge from. you yourself said we should compare this salah to 13-14 cuadrado, because thats the last time he actually played constantly in more advanced positions. and cuadrado played for an inferior offensive team compared to this roma which you also ignore + cuadrado is more of a classic winger because he rarely cuts inside to shoot and rarely moves into goalscoring areas because his 1st instinct is to go wide most of the time. yet he still outnumbers salahs best season when playing more offensively in same number of games. if salah gets more goals or assists, which he probably will, we will have to count their goals/assists per game ratio. why? for another reason you constantly ignore because otherwise you wouldnt be able to bullshit around - they are on the same number of games that can be taken as example here, as clearly seen in my post above. so if salah gets more goals and assists it will not necessarily mean he has a more effective season. age doesent matter at all, nor does how many seasons at top level he has. you said he was a better offensive player, which was proven to be wrong.
what happens in next few years is also irrelevant
Add to this, if you look at the whoscored stats for 13-14 when Cuadrado played about 75% of his matches in attacking positions he still had vastly better defensive stats, passing stats, long ball stats, dribbling stats, etc.
Far better all around player, and equal to Salah when looking exclusively at attacking output when they are playing the same position.
Not to mention they are 2 very different types of attacking wingers. Cuadrado being a more traditional wide winger with fantastic crossing ability and the skills to play alongside a CF, whereas Salah is terrible at giving service to a CF which is part of the reason Dzeko has sucked so badly for Roma. He's a goal scoring winger who plus inside, can't cross worth a damn, and isn't a particularly gifted passer.
As in, all Salah offers is goalscoring. Whereas Cuadrado offers passing, crossing, long balls, and defensive contributions.
Add to this, if you look at the whoscored stats for 13-14 when Cuadrado played about 75% of his matches in attacking positions he still had vastly better defensive stats, passing stats, long ball stats, dribbling stats, etc.
Far better all around player, and equal to Salah when looking exclusively at attacking output when they are playing the same position.
Not to mention they are 2 very different types of attacking wingers. Cuadrado being a more traditional wide winger with fantastic crossing ability and the skills to play alongside a CF, whereas Salah is terrible at giving service to a CF which is part of the reason Dzeko has sucked so badly for Roma. He's a goal scoring winger who plus inside, can't cross worth a damn, and isn't a particularly gifted passer.
As in, all Salah offers is goalscoring. Whereas Cuadrado offers passing, crossing, long balls, and defensive contributions.
and you still have not explained why Villareal match is big but not the matches from the same stage and later stages in the same competition last season.
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