[ITA] Serie A 2015/2016 (18 Viewers)

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pavluska

Senior Member
Apr 25, 2013
7,339
If we win the title this season, it seems Andrea Agnelli's and Beppe Marotta's Juve won't be joint record holders with five consecutive scudetti (except on the record books). Apparently, Pro Vercelli would have won six on the trot - from 1908 to 1913 - if not for Inter's cheating in 1910:

http://m.runofplay.com/2009/04/23/pro-vercelli-the-ghosts-of-1910/

Basically, the synopsis is:

Pro Vercelli and Inter ended on the same number of points, and Pro Vercelli, by rule, were supposed to win because they had the better goal difference. However, FIGC decided that Pro Vercelli and Inter should play a tie-breaker with the winner to be crowned the champions. Then FIGC, in collaboration with Inter, selected a date when Pro Vercelli players were supposed to be away on a military tournament, which they had already committed to. FIGC refused to change the date. In protest, Pro Vercelli fielded their 4th team (made of 10-15 yo's) and they lost the game 10-3 (worst "defeat" in club's history).

Amazing. Did Inter ever win a legitimate scudetto? They cheated even in the pre-war era.

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What "La Grande Inter" did to win in the 60s are more well known:

Italian champions that have made the history of Football, will be called to testify in front of Rome's tribunal on doping. Sandro Mazzola, Mariolino Corso, Luis Suarez, Tarcisio Burnich, Gianfranco Bedin, Angelo Domenghini, Aristide Guarneri aswell as Ferruccio Mazzola will all be called to reveal what was behind La Grande Inter's success, in Italy and the World, during the 60's. Ferruccio added: "I haven't longed for a trial. I just happen to be involved now. All the truth will finally be made public".

Q: What are you referring to Mr Mazzola?
Mazzola: Even if just a bench player, I was part of that Inter too. I've seen with my eyes how player were treated. I saw Helenio Herrera providing pills that were to be placed under our tongues. He used to experiment on us bench players only to later give them to the first team players. Some of us would eventually spit them. It was my brother Sandro that suggested me that if I had no intention of taking them, to just run to the toilette and spit them. Eventually Herrera found out and decided to dilute them in coffee. From that day on "Il Caffè Herrera" became a habit at Inter.

Q: What was inside those pills:
A: Don't know for sure but I believe anphetamins. Once, after a Caffè Herrera, it was prior to a Como vs Inter (1967), I suffered 3 days and nights in a state of complete allucinations, just like an epilletic. Nowdays, everybody denies, even Sandro......

Q: Your brother?
A: Yes Sandro and I, since I decided to speak out, simply don't talk to eachother. He says that dirty laudry should be washed at home, on the contrarary, I believe that it's right to speak out, above all for a number of my former teamates, a number of which are either very sick or dead.

Q: To whom are you referring too:
A: The first was Armando Picchi, captain of the team, that died aged 36 due to a cancer. Then came Marcello Giusti, a reserve player, that died for a brain cancer during the 90's. Carlo Tagnin, a great player that would never refuse a pill, since he wanted to further his career as long as possible, he died in year 2000.
Mauro Bicicli and Ferdinando Miniussi have left us respectively in 2001 and 2002. Enea Masiero, with Inter from 1955 to 1964, is undertaking chemotherapy, whilst Pino Longoni is on a wheel chair.

Q: But for Picchi and Tagnin, all the other players are not that famous.
A: That's cause us bench players would take more of those damned white pills, were treated as cavies. I talked about all this in my autobiography ('Il terzo incomodo', scritto con Fabrizio Càlzia, Bradipolibri 2004), that eventually lead to the opening of athe Rome trail.

Q: Why?
A: Cause after the book was published, I was sued by Inter President Mr Facchetti. They want to go in front of a jury? Very well, the 19th of November, their will be a 2nd hearing. All the players of that team, I mean all the players that are still alive, have a choice to testify. I just want to see if they won't have the courage to say the truth under oath.

Q: Weren't you once freids with Facchetti?
A: Yes, let's just leave Facchetti out of this, I'd have to mention heavy stuff.

Q: Do you think that after the trial we will have another kind of image upon that winning Inter?
A: Frankly, I don't know and I'm not interested. If I wanted to cause real damage to Inter, within the book, I could have added a number of other episodes. I could have added details about fixed matches and bribed referees, especially in Cup ties. Never mind.
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taking back possession ?
Tackling and intercepting have separate stats. Maybe recovering entails to recovering loose balls. 74 is a big number.
 

catch22

Senior Member
Aug 23, 2015
557
This is Italy. If any one of you think any of the top clubs in Italy have a history not filled with cheating and corruption you're an idiot. Are Inter fans stupid for pointing the finger without looking at themselves, yes, but fans are inherently one eyed so it doesn't bother me too much.
 

napoleonic

Senior Member
Sep 7, 2010
4,129
That is not the problem right now, the problem is we are the victim that is suffering the most from this italian football antics

I just saw the sports news about tennis match fixing scandal in a local newspaper, out of nowhere they mentioned about calciopoli, if they continued down that road, inevitably juventus name would poped out.

That kind of thing is defamation, especially with the fact that in italy we already legally cleared from calciopoli
 

pavluska

Senior Member
Apr 25, 2013
7,339
This is Italy. If any one of you think any of the top clubs in Italy have a history not filled with cheating and corruption you're an idiot. Are Inter fans stupid for pointing the finger without looking at themselves, yes, but fans are inherently one eyed so it doesn't bother me too much.
You're partially right. It's mafia land Italy, and I'm sure most clubs engaged in some illicit activity at one point or the other. But the degree and frequency of such activities aren't the same for every club, and that makes a big difference.

No other club drugged their players to the point of death. No other club is known for winning two CL's (or European Cup as it was known back then) via bribing referees. And no other club "designed" a calciopoli to get rid of their biggest rivals and profited from it when they themselves deserved relegation (all the proof conveniently didn't come out till after the statute of limitations had passed).

While most Italian clubs have surely done something shady one or more times in their history, Inter screams worst of the lot. No other team comes close.

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That is not the problem right now, the problem is we are the victim that is suffering the most from this italian football antics

I just saw the sports news about tennis match fixing scandal in a local newspaper, out of nowhere they mentioned about calciopoli, if they continued down that road, inevitably juventus name would poped out.

That kind of thing is defamation, especially with the fact that in italy we already legally cleared from calciopoli
From sporting and financial points of view, we're fine now (at least improving financially), and they're rotting. I'm really happy about where we're now as a club and how its being run. But the fact that non-Serie A watchers (which is most fans nowadays) have no clue about Calciopoli, Juve, and Inter does bother me. It's annoying when they mention Calciopoli and Juve in relation to it and have no idea about Inter. Literally, the only thing they know about Calciopoli is that Juve were "found" guilty and were demoted.
 

Zacheryah

Senior Member
Aug 29, 2010
42,251
I got some kind of expenation to relativate calciopoli i tend to tell. Do point out if its flawed


"Calciopoli, was about clubs picking what referee would lead their game. We all asume a ref is a ref, but that isnt true. Take for example Chelsea and Barcelona. If you'd have a very strict ref that blows the wistle on every contact, it will obviously favor barcelona. If you got a hardman ref who thinks football isnt for pathetic fags and only whistles when its actually a decent foul, it will obviously not favor barcelona, but chelsea instead.

What happened during calciopoli, is 3 teams had their manager ask the ref designator, to pick a ref they tought was going to suit their gamestyle more. That ref was not bribed in any way, he was just preferred by style.

Juventus got all the blame, milan a lil bit and inter got away, however out of expired (i dont know the term @Seven verjaard in dutch )evidence later , it seemed inter was most involved into it.
FIFA, UEFA, FIGC, thinks refs are equal. So why did they detract points from juve, who wanted a specific ref ?

And doesnt everyone do that. In belgium for example, we have huge media pressure by managers/trainers on certain refs so they dont get chosen, or come under a fuckload of stress, how is that any better ?"
 

napoleonic

Senior Member
Sep 7, 2010
4,129
You're partially right. It's mafia land Italy, and I'm sure most clubs engaged in some illicit activity at one point or the other. But the degree and frequency of such activities aren't the same for every club, and that makes a big difference.

No other club drugged their players to the point of death. No other club is known for winning two CL's (or European Cup as it was known back then) via bribing referees. And no other club "designed" a calciopoli to get rid of their biggest rivals and profited from it when they themselves deserved relegation (all the proof conveniently didn't come out till after the statute of limitations had passed).

While most Italian clubs have surely done something shady one or more times in their history, Inter screams worst of the lot. No other team comes close.

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From sporting and financial points of view, we're fine now (at least improving financially), and they're rotting. I'm really happy about where we're now as a club and how its being run. But the fact that non-Serie A watchers (which is most fans nowadays) have no clue about Calciopoli, Juve, and Inter does bother me. It's annoying when they mention Calciopoli and Juve in relation to it and have no idea about Inter. Literally, the only thing they know about Calciopoli is that Juve were "found" guilty and were demoted.
Seriously, I read several football forums an hour ago, some from epl, some from la liga; guess what, many of them are actually rooting for merda, and generally they see us as the vermin of italian football instead of merda, and not just merda there, generally they cheer for milan roma napoli etc but we are always viewed with cheater label of sort

I honestly not sure if one can say that such depressing worldview has literally zero effect on our players or players that can join us, especially in this age of political correctness
 

pavluska

Senior Member
Apr 25, 2013
7,339
Seriously, I read several football forums an hour ago, some from epl, some from la liga; guess what, many of them are actually rooting for merda, and generally they see us as the vermin of italian football instead of merda, and not just merda there, generally they cheer for milan roma napoli etc but we are always viewed with cheater label of sort

I honestly not sure if one can say that such depressing worldview has literally zero effect on our players or players that can join us, especially in this age of political correctness
Yeah, that's what most La Liga mugs and premfaces think of Juve and Inter.


Below is an article about Inter bribing in Europe (written in 2003). Also, Jonathan Wilson in his well-known book Inverting the Pyramid claims Herrera fixed matches.





This Football Life: Moratti in a real fix over Inter's glorious but tainted
history
By Brian Glanville (The Times)


FOR Inter Milan fans, Massimo Moratti, the club president, can do nothing
right. At the San Siro they usually jeer him. While AC Milan, their eternal
city rivals, flaunt the European Cup, Inter have not won the scudetto, the
Italian title, since 1989, when they left Milan a dozen points behind.

Under the draconian managership of the flamboyant Helenio Herrera, the
European Cup was won twice, the scudetto four times. In the foyer of Inter's
training ground stands a bust of Angelo Moratti, below it a most effusive
eulogy. But when Keith Botsford, my American colleague, and I were
investigating what we called The Years of the Golden Fix, it transpired that
Inter's European victories of the 1960s were the fruit of bribery and
corruption in which Angelo Moratti played a crucial part in a process
implemented by two men also now dead: Dezso Solti, the Hungarian fixer, and
the serpentine Italo Allodi. Inter's secretary, he became general manager of
Juventus when we showed them to be guilty of an abortive attempt to "buy" a
Portuguese referee.

Three years in a row, Inter made offers to referees in the second legs of
European Cup semi-finals to be played at the San Siro and twice it worked,
in 1964 and 1965, when they went on to win the final. On the third occasion,
in 1966, Gyorgy Vadas, a brave Hungarian official, refused to be bribed.
Real Madrid held out and went on to lift the trophy.

In 1964, the sufferers were Borussia Dortmund, who had a key player sent
off. In 1965 it was Liverpool, victims of two dreadful decisions by Ortiz de
Mendibil, the Spaniard. Botsford and I knew that Vadas refused to be
tempted; getting him to talk years later was the problem.

Having flown to Budapest, we at last managed to meet him in the dim
cafeteria of Radio Budapest, where everybody involved in Hungarian football,
good guys and bad, seemed to be working. Large, good-natured, anxious, he
refused to talk; he had plainly suffered enough. Not another international
match would he get after that night. It was left to Peter Borenich, a
talented, persistent young local journalist, to get him to speak and publish
what he said in Only The Ball Has A Skin.

Solti had been with him and his linesman, Vadas said, from morning to night.
When they were alone in his hotel room, Solti offered him enough money to
buy five Mercedes if he bent the match for Inter, payable in dollars -
double if Inter won on a late penalty, five times as much were they to win
by a penalty in extra time.

On the morning of the match, Vadas and his linesman were invited to Angelo
Moratti's villa for lunch. He at once gave each a gold watch. During the
meal he told Solti to buy them colour television sets and a host of
electrical appliances. But Vadas refereed the match impeccably. At
half-time, Solti invaded his dressing-room, ranting that he had failed to
give three penalties. At 5am the next day, Solti phoned his friend, Gyorgy
Honti, secretary of the Hungarian football federation, to tell him that
Vadas had cheated Inter out of the match. Back in Budapest, Vadas was faced
by an outraged Honti.

Yet Angelo Moratti is still revered.
 
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