Israeli-Palestinian conflict (22 Viewers)

[Turk_Bianconero]

Because it means their identity, religion and cultural values will be lost.

say everything but this part is extremely unfair.Those people lived in Ottoman rule for centuries and they haven't lose what you mentioned in your post.Ottomans could assimilate those orthodoxs,jews,armenians etc in those years.Do you know why don't you and me speak in Turkish now?Because we were an empire but we were not colonial like france,england,usa etc.They lived their religion,culture and speak in their language as we let them to do it.

 

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[Eddy]

by this logic,borders of %99 of countries in the world should change because they occupied another one's lands sometime in history.

And just to answer you on this question, no Turk, 99% of countries won't change their borders because sadly, the people living there have been misplaced or somewhat annihilated. Look at the Indians in America, they butchered them, and for that, America will remain America. The Indians aren't the majority like they used to be hundreds of years ago so there is no one left to politically fight. No one to fight cause they massacred them, they were gone, dead. Look at the Assyrians, you misplaced them and there aren't many Assyrians as they were hundreds of years ago. The Pontic Greeks, gone from Erzincan because you butchered them and they had to leave to the Black Sea because of the last 20 years of the Ottoman regime.

 

[Eddy]

say everything but this part is extremely unfair.Those people lived in Ottoman rule for centuries and they haven't lose what you mentioned in your post.Ottomans could assimilate those orthodoxs,jews,armenians etc in those years.Do you know why don't you and me speak in Turkish now?Because we were an empire but we were not colonial like france,england,usa etc.They lived their religion,culture and speak in their language as we let them to do it.

Of course Turk, I'm not saying Ottoman Empire was a colonial aggression like other European countries, but the last 20 years of the Ottoman Empire were a living hell and I'm sure you know this already.

 

[mcrae]

They aren't the most popular folks around, are they?
It's really something to think about. Was the problem in those who expelled them or the problem was in the Jews themselves ?

the problem is that Jewish haters can't get over the fact that such a tiny ethnic group can be so powerful and influential at the same time despite the numberless attempts to exterminate them.

 

[Lawnchair Bes]

say everything but this part is extremely unfair.Those people lived in Ottoman rule for centuries and they haven't lose what you mentioned in your post.Ottomans could assimilate those orthodoxs,jews,armenians etc in those years.Do you know why don't you and me speak in Turkish now?Because we were an empire but we were not colonial like france,england,usa etc.They lived their religion,culture and speak in their language as we let them to do it.

are you stupid? albanians had to either convert to islam or be killed

 

[Snoop]

say everything but this part is extremely unfair.Those people lived in Ottoman rule for centuries and they haven't lose what you mentioned in your post.Ottomans could assimilate those orthodoxs,jews,armenians etc in those years.Do you know why don't you and me speak in Turkish now?Because we were an empire but we were not colonial like france,england,usa etc.They lived their religion,culture and speak in their language as we let them to do it.

That's a big lie Turk. The lie the kemalists forced you to believe all these years, you know they are everywhere even in your educational system.. I recommend you to stop being biased, and listen more to the people who suffered from the Ottomans. You can't find the truth by listening what your side tells all the time. Did you forgot what just happened in few months? www.ozurdiliyoruz.com ?All these years it wasn't allowed for you to question the genocide all these years. Now these days it's a little different, even thou still Turkey is not a free country. We saw what happened to Hrant Dinks and the likes, we see very well how those who started that internet campaign face the trial of "301". Open your eyes, and see how the truth is even being hidden/censored to be spoken..

 

[CheSchifo!]

say everything but this part is extremely unfair.Those people lived in Ottoman rule for centuries and they haven't lose what you mentioned in your post.Ottomans could assimilate those orthodoxs,jews,armenians etc in those years.Do you know why don't you and me speak in Turkish now?Because we were an empire but we were not colonial like france,england,usa etc.They lived their religion,culture and speak in their language as we let them to do it.

Not colonial you say? But then again you mention the USA as a colonial power in the same sentence, so I guess you're not worthy of a response .

 

[The Arif]

They lived their religion,culture and speak in their language as we let them to do it.

Not true. As Bes said:

are you stupid? albanians had to either convert to islam or be killed

Albanians were forced to convert to Islam. I don't think Ottomans really killed those who didn't convert, but they put a lot of taxes to those who didn't want to convert.

 

[Lawnchair Bes]

i was trying to sound more dramatic

 

[The Arif]

i was trying to sound more dramatic

Haha, you got me there.

 

[Turk_Bianconero]

Open your eyes, and see how the truth is even being hidden/censored to be spoken..

those people who participate in that organization are jews,armenians and other minorities.their name is Turkish,they speak Turkish but they are not Turkish.Some of them are actually Turkish intellectuals who are selling their country for money and nobel.They are not our voice.so Turks are not responsible for their miserable activities.if they have 30.000 sympathizers, opposite have 30 million.
i saw a terrorist's name on their main page,that says all.

I saw arguments from two sides and this is my opinion ; everytime we face this accusations it is only because they want a bigger armenia.they want our east provinces as compensation but we won't accept it.Ottoman archieves are fully open if somebody interests.

Albanians were forced to convert to Islam. I don't think Ottomans really killed those who didn't convert, but they put a lot of taxes to those who didn't want to convert.

every non-muslim paid that tax as compensation of not joining the army.

are you stupid? albanians had to either convert to islam or be killed

how do you live then?

 

[The Arif]

every non-muslim paid that tax as compensation of not joining the army.

Again, not true. Non-muslims (I'm talking about albanians here) were forced to pay that tax for refusing to convert to islam, not for not joining the army as you stated.

 

[Zé Tahir]

Aww poor you

 

[CheSchifo!]

Again, not true. Non-muslims (I'm talking about albanians here) were forced to pay that tax for refusing to convert to islam, not for not joining the army as you stated.

I can say for a fact that's what the Mamluks made Christians do in Eygpt in the Middle Ages though .

 

[Zé Tahir]

I don't know exactly the history of Islam in Albania but there might be a logical reason for that tax, Arif. As a Muslim you are required to pay alms to help the poor, so in a way it's a 'tax' that helps the masses. As a non-Muslim you are obviously not required to pay alms so taxing non-Muslims that reside in that nation makes perfect sense. Therefore I highly doubt that non-Muslims were taxed just because they chose not to accept Islam.

 

[Alen]

Turk, did you hear about Halil İnalcık, or did you read something from him?

I'm currently reading one of his books and i wanted to check his biography on the net. It turns out that he's considered to be the leading and most respected Turkish historian about the Ottoman period. In Turkey he's treated as #1 about the Ottoman period, and he's even more respected outside Turkey.
No-one writes anything about the Ottoman period without consulting the literature writen by İnalcık.
Among other reasons, he's respected because he's a real professional and one can't help wondering how can a Turk be so neutral about his own country.
He broke many myths that the Ottomans were animals, or barbarians and savages, but he also broke many myths in Turkey and he told a more realistic story about what was really happening.
He's not writing about that touchy period in the late 19 and early 20 century, though. He writes more about 14-17 century.

You should read his books sometime if you haven't already.

 

[Snoop]

those people who participate in that organization are jews,armenians and other minorities.their name is Turkish,they speak Turkish but they are not Turkish.Some of them are actually Turkish intellectuals who are selling their country for money and nobel.

 

[The Arif]

I don't know exactly the history of Islam in Albania but there might be a logical reason for that tax, Arif. As a Muslim you are required to pay alms to help the poor, so in a way it's a 'tax' that helps the masses. As a non-Muslim you are obviously not required to pay alms so taxing non-Muslims that reside in that nation makes perfect sense. Therefore I highly doubt that non-Muslims were taxed just because they chose not to accept Islam.

Well, that's how it was in Albania.

EDIT: And what logical reason are you talking about? There were no muslims in Albania before Ottomans came. And non-muslims paid taxes, not muslims.

 

[Eddy]

those people who participate in that organization are jews,armenians and other minorities.their name is Turkish,they speak Turkish but they are not Turkish.Some of them are actually Turkish intellectuals who are selling their country for money and nobel.They are not our voice.so Turks are not responsible for their miserable activities.if they have 30.000 sympathizers, opposite have 30 million.
i saw a terrorist's name on their main page,that says all.

And there it is, the Turkish propaganda machine and the ideology behind it. I was waiting for it. Thank you Turk for showing it to all of us.

 

[JCK]

It seems that Rebel has left the building, and that sucks.