Gangs and violence (2 Viewers)

Layce Erayce

Senior Member
Aug 11, 2002
9,116
#1
I've read a lot about "chavs", armed guys raping girls, immigrant gangs, local gangs, etc recently on here.

I dont hear much about it in the US however. Or maybe nowhere near as much. Even among low-income groups or minorities, or drop-outs, etc.

Why do you think there seems to be such a big problem regarding gangs and violence in Europe while the US's problems with gangs/violence seems much more minor?

Do you even think that is the case at all? Perhaps its the same or even more in the US?

I want to know what people think is the cause of these problems.
 

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JCK

Biased
JCK
May 11, 2004
125,381
#2
Well, I can tell you what I have observed for the past few weeks. I live in Gothenburg, Sweden and on the 3rd of september Eminem and 50 Cent are having a concert in town. You cannot imagine tha amount of wannabee gangs that are around at the moment.

I guess this is one of the biggest influences.
 
Jan 7, 2004
29,704
#6
trust me we get a lot of that shit in canada


2 weeks ago they release stats that crime rate has dropped by 12%

2 weeks later in toronto we get something like 12 shoot outs and 7 or something killed, one of them over a parking spot and another a 3 year old child passer by
 

swag

L'autista
Administrator
Sep 23, 2003
84,750
#7
Gangs used to be huge (pronounce that by dropping the 'h' if you're Italian or just from North Jersey ;) ) here in the States, particularly back in the 1980s. While many gangs came to prominence in the 1960s, the combination with drug money and access to firearms went all Scarface by the time the 80s rolled around.

That Bloods vs. Crips sort of thing. What colors you can wear in certain neighborhoods. (America doesn't have football teams for this. ;) ). In Chicago, where the gangs were more about rivalries, drugs, and tagging more than any gang colors (ironic that Chicago gangs would tend to be the "colorblind" ones) we had everything from the Insane 22s, the Latin Kings, the Vice Lords, the Latin Counts, the Blackstone Rangers, etc.

Since then, drug crime has shifted and the gangs don't seem to be associated with todays meth labs as much as the smaller groups of loners now associated with them. Gangs have also gone more suburban and even online for that matter. The growth in Asian gangs has occurred, but they seem more into hotwiring and stealing Acuras than anything that violent these days.

But now I don't see the signs of gangs in the U.S. as I used to -- in cities and in the news. Something about being in the suburbs and being on computers that makes in difficult to be too hard core and vicious? I don't know...
 
Aug 1, 2003
17,696
#8
Malaysia is currently dealing with "gangsterism" and "bullying" problem .... It has worsened for the past recent years, cases such as seniors (bullies) bullying and resulting in a junior's death... In high school.
 

Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
Mar 16, 2004
115,984
#9
++ [ originally posted by jaecole ] ++
Police are the worst gang.
Right. Perhaps we should just rid ourselves of the police. Then when somebody rolls up next to you with a nine there will be nobody to make him think twice about pulling the trigger.
 

jaecole

Senior Member
Apr 7, 2005
3,017
#10
++ [ originally posted by Andy ] ++


Right. Perhaps we should just rid ourselves of the police. Then when somebody rolls up next to you with a nine there will be nobody to make him think twice about pulling the trigger.
What has that got to do with anything? Doesn't change the fact either. And noone 'rolls up to me with a nine', whatever that means, different worlds mate and besides, would you really even know what you are talking about?
 
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Layce Erayce

Senior Member
Aug 11, 2002
9,116
  • Thread Starter
  • Thread Starter #11
    Jaecole I have a good relationship with the police force where I live at the moment. Small, lazy suburban town with a small, friendly police force who know you by your first name. No gangs, little violence, lots of drugs but the cops dont know.

    Its a pity law enforcement doesnt work for you. What stops you from unloading a few rounds into a chav to teach the others a lesson? Surely it isnt the cops, is it?

    Shadowfax sorry, that was a terribly response. Where does survival of the fittest factor into the situation? Where is survival even under threat here?

    Swag while meth labs are being run, and drugs continue to flourish, there seems to be no need to resort to violence to protect their activities or their presence. This is surely a good thing as innocent bystanders dont get involved unwittingly.

    I believe that gangs/violence stems from social problems. Immigrants wouldnt form gangs unless they were intimidated by locals- I know this happens in Europe, or if they were separated into a class of their own, especially inferior.
     

    jaecole

    Senior Member
    Apr 7, 2005
    3,017
    #12
    I didn't say it dosen't work. It's obvious to anyone that law enforcement is essential. Unfortunately like I said, police can be as bad a gang as anyone. It just takes the wrong person to say the wrong thing, be in the wrong place at the wrong time etc to get yourself in alot of trouble. It takes a certain type of person to be a cop imo and unfortunately that dosen't work with the type of person alot of my generation, myself included, are. Police are perfect if you fit the profile, if you don't then many times, they aren't. Often they will want you to do something to give them the chance to punish you.

    Be a junkie, 'mosher', Irish etc and you will suffer from police if you don't stay away. Same with bouncers or any security. The English man that is the cop, the security simply won't work with the guy with long hair, the junkie on the street or the dude with some piercings. Try to ease the suffering of a person and you will bring it on yourself.

    I've seen junkies kicked senseless by police. I've seen them on the ground handcuffed, trying only to cover their head while a group of police officers kick them, punch them, hit them with batons or mace them. Being Irish is another real problem, or alternative/mosh/goth/emo or whatever. To understand that you really need to understand the typical scouse and you won't be able to do that.

    Junkie/homeless whatever, we are all humans and it makes me sick and makes many hate police with a passion, for some people (not myself) that have an attitude that leads to further problems because next time you will think fvck the cop and you will atleast let him know it before he puts you down.

    Of course let me specify that this isn't the case with all police. A minority probably but that minority cause more problems for people I know and people around me than any other 'gang' we experience. A chav might steal my phone and punch me, a cop might put me on the ground and kick the shit out of me, pull my jeans down to my ankles because I wear them to low. Throw me on the street because I belong there or spray me with mace because I wasn't following orders.

    Ask Claire for her latest cop story if you want to be amazed. And she is a small, short and weak girl.

    It's only logic that some police will be thugs. Late night England, ESPECIALLY late night Liverpool really isn't such a safe place for those I mentioned. Though I don't hold it against the police I hold it against the individual. The police in general are amazing and we have one of the best forces in the world. Unfortunately though if you aren't going to fit in you aren't going to have their support always.

    Don't have a problem with this anyone, it's simply my own experience and I would know nothing of your own police. I also realise there are many police who do a great job and keep me safe every day.
     

    mikhail

    Senior Member
    Jan 24, 2003
    9,576
    #15
    There's plenty of that alright. To put a slightly wider perspective on it, police forces are notorious for protecting their own. Corrupt groups can go unchecked until the media get wind of it. Good examples abound. In Donegal, the county beside Derry in the north-west corner of Ireland, we had a case recently of policemen planting evidence to frame a bloke they'd had a feud with. As far as anyone can tell, the guy's never broken the law - they just hated each other. Same bunch (I think) built up their reps by planting "IRA" weapons either side of the boarder, "discovering" them later in a demonstration of quality poice work.
     

    mikhail

    Senior Member
    Jan 24, 2003
    9,576
    #17
    ++ [ originally posted by Shadowfax ] ++
    nothing wrong with a bit of police brutality... good for the soul... Scag eads deserve it anyway
    I don't mind it in small quantities. Being a bit rough with someone isn't all that serious an issue. There was a young scumbag over here recently, who gave some cheek to some police arresting his D&D friend. He got brought in too. His dad was told that he was out of his head on drugs, signed him over to police custody for the night. Anyway, the autopsy found no drugs (or alcohol) in his system) and the cause of death was head trauma. Draw your own conclusions.
     

    ashwin

    Junior Member
    Jul 19, 2005
    190
    #19
    here's some statistics:

    america:

    Adults prosecuted: 14,203,822 (1999)
    (per capita): 48.02 per 1000 people

    netherlands:

    Adults prosecuted: 177,062 (1999)
    (per capita): 10.79 per 1000 people

    just picked NL as an example of an european country since i live here. crime doesn't seem to be that much worse here than in the states. ofcourse i understand that u can't go by these statistics only, america have a significant amount more ppl prosecuted per 1000 ppl than NL. surely this suggests that crime that bad in holland, a european country, than in america
     

    cuore

    Junior Member
    Aug 10, 2005
    170
    #20
    We have the hells angels and the Mafia as well as some street gangs. They mostly just go after themselves though. It's not a huge problem.
     

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