Farsopoli(Calciopoli) (17 Viewers)

[swag]

PhRoZeN is right. If the three break apart on this -- Juve, Moggi, and Giraudo -- then everything is going to fall apart like three criminal suspects who point fingers at each other to take the fall.

However, if the three have their act together, because they are obviously intertwined, then they might actually achieve something.

 

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[pavelnedved]

let's hope for the best ...

 

[Jem83]

Imagine all of this backfiring on us and we get a stricter penalty or even a restoration of our first one

Anything can happen, so don't rule it out.

Still, I'm glad our board of directors are appealing against this preposterous verdict. And it's great to see Juventus standing by Moggi & Co and vice versa. I know, like ReBeL here pointed out, that the innocence of each party depends on the other one, but I really do believe in Juventus always wanting to stand by players, staff and fans - past and present.

Hopefully justice will be served.

 

[mnementh]

Nothing left to lose, after losing hope

Never lose hope. Even "hopeless" has the word "hope" in it.

 

[d.nico]

Never lose hope. Even "hopeless" has the word "hope" in it.

Good word. Really good word.

 

[d.nico]

He said there is only suspicion about one game, and that todesnt even involve Juve.

Why this post get warning? And she get banned for this?
Is it because of cafejuventus?

 

[sateeh]

PhRoZeN is right. If the three break apart on this -- Juve, Moggi, and Giraudo -- then everything is going to fall apart like three criminal suspects who point fingers at each other to take the fall.

However, if the three have their act together, because they are obviously intertwined, then they might actually achieve something.

spot on , although i dont expect much from those appeals.The most could be decreasing the point deductions.Since viola and lazio r appealing too, then this could be negative to us as they could be demoted down to serie B, and give us problems nextt season.

 

[Seven]

Conclude sulla Juventus: "Mi meraviglio che si lamentino. Per la Juve ci sono ipotesi di articolo 6. I suoi dirigenti avevano messo su un certo meccanismo
sandulli says juve have indirectly violated article 6

"ipotesi".

 

[Jun-hide]

Regardless of whether the sentence is fair or not Moggi, and Giraudo were the one who initiated whole scandal from the first place, and I just cannot believe that Juve's new management team is supporting these two crooks.
If anythingelse shareholders should take them to the court for the damage caused to the company's value.
Nonetheless, I just can't see what to gain by putting these two fuckers into prison, and moreover what they can exactly do for Juventus.
I guess it is time to move on, and try to get penalty reduced as much as possible.
Serie B with no penalty is clearly better than Serie A with serious penalty deduction.

 

[JuveBoy]

Regardless of whether the sentence is fair or not Moggi, and Giraudo were the one who initiated whole scandal from the first place, and I just cannot believe that Juve's new management team is supporting these two crooks.
If anythingelse shareholders should take them to the court for the damage caused to the company's value.
Nonetheless, I just can't see what to gain by putting these two fuckers into prison, and moreover what they can exactly do for Juventus.
I guess it is time to move on, and try to get penalty reduced as much as possible.

Serie B with no penalty is clearly better than Serie A with serious penalty deduction.

Yes, good point. Serie B is good to rejuvenate everything. And beside that, everyone will understand and realise that there are alot of anti-juve in Italy and we will get more and more respect in the world.

 

[TueF]

Actually, it is B to C1, not A to C1. People keep getting this wrong.

Genoa was not able to achieve Serie A just as Juve was not able to keep their scudetti of the past couple of seasons. The results of the season were null and void in the context of the violation, so Genoa dropped from B...not A.

I think that's a matter of interpretation. They won promotion from B to A but were then relegated to C1 - does that mean that they were relegated two divisions or just one? If they hadn't been relegated, they would have played in Serie A, but they never actually played in the top division before being relegated.

 

[TueF]

Tue F

The critical issue for me is not so much the severity of guilt because it depends essentially on one's stands but rather how these severity of guilt corresponds to the sentence given.
As far as I am concerned, I have not yet been informed on what basis these correspondence were made, which may partly be down to my inability to speak Italian, whic may have limited access to information, but I doubt whether Italians know much more than me.
One should also consider the fact that a lot of information press gets are leaks, which, unless one is an idiot, will know are done some intention to shape up certain public opinions etc.

So to sum up, people have not been informed fully about the process behind the sentences, which has big influence on their welfare.
Regardless of whether the sentence was unjust or not, there was clear lack of transparency in the whole juridical process. Now that is clearly immoral. To argue otherwise, is just purely ignorant.
Secondly, because we do not have not been informed of the basis used by the judiciary to determine sentences, we can only speculate about the severity of guilty and the appropriateness of sentences.
My speculation is that, which I will not mention again as I have mentioned in the past, there was no basis to begin with.
If there was, then my word, I sincerely question the intellectual capacity of one of the highest official in the whole Italia. The inability to distinguish various parties involved in the whole scandal and that the club is just a legal entity, and complete ignorance of the notion of responsibility and capacity - such imbecile should not be a judge regardless of the technical process behind the trial.
Oh yeah, it would take quite an argument to convince me that somehow a 8point penalty in a Juve less championship and participation in CL for Milan constitute as a penalty. What did Milan exactly loose? They normally beat Inter by that margin if not more most of the season. Even if Inter doesnt find way to self-distruct to loose 8 point gap, Milan will surely win a CL place next year taking into consideration that Lazio, Fiorentina will be busy fighting relegation and Juve will be in Serie B.
Forget about us, Fiorentina, & Lazio. Milan has definetely CHEATED. THAT IS A FACT. Now can YOU say that is a penalty? If guilty, team should be penalized.

Good post.

I agree that the lack of transparency in this process has been and still is a very big problem. Possibly the biggest problem of all.

It is, in my mind, the reason that we're still discussing it. Had we been able to read exactly what the clubs and people involved were charged with and convicted off a lot of speculation surrounding the issue would go away.

Milan seem to have got off very lightly indeed, but I don't know if it's true as I don't have access to the evidence against them, and this is the case regarding all the other clubs and people involved as well.

All we have now are wildly different punishments for the parties involved with little or no explanation why this is so, and so people are free to speculate. Inter-fans feel vindicated in their beliefs that they've been cheated by Juve over the years. Juve-fans feel like the scapegoat in a Soviet show trial designed to appease the masses, and who can blame either? The lack of transparency does nothing to help Italian football get over this scandal, it only makes the sides point fingers at each other.

A reason for this might be the speed with which the process was carried out. The process had to be finished by the UEFA deadline and so seemed to be rushed through. Given the amount of evidence and the number of people and clubs involved, it seems that the tribunals cut a few corners here and there to be done in time. Again, I have no way of knowing if this is true or not, but since people are now talking about Juve's appeal alone taking months or years in the civil courts, the speed of the sporting tribunal was astounding to say the least.

Another reason for lack of transparency could be the variety of charges brought against the clubs and people involved, Moggi in particular. The "match-fixing" is one thing, but the accusations of tax evasion, undue influence through GEA and whatnot only muddied the waters. A lot of, normally bright, people I know can't distinguish between the various cases and parties involved and since information isn't forthcoming each is left to draw his own conclusions.

Anyway, I agree that this is a big mess and that Milans punishment hardly qualifies as that. As I stated above it might be right that they were let off with a light sentence. It might also be a crime against humanity for all I know.

Ah well, only a few hours of work left, then I'm off to get drunk for the weekend. int:

 

[- vOnAm -]

Why this post get warning? And she get banned for this?
Is it because of cafejuventus?

How the hell did u get soo much money in ur bank? Donate some tu Juve man!

or atleast me...

 

[mnementh]

Tuttosport is the best

 

[ßöмßäяðîëя]

One quick question, can you guys appeal the appeal?

 

[swag]

All the way up to the People's Court with Judge Wapner, bro.

 

[Vinman]

Tue F

The critical issue for me is not so much the severity of guilt because it depends essentially on one's stands but rather how these severity of guilt corresponds to the sentence given.
As far as I am concerned, I have not yet been informed on what basis these correspondence were made, which may partly be down to my inability to speak Italian, whic may have limited access to information, but I doubt whether Italians know much more than me.
One should also consider the fact that a lot of information press gets are leaks, which, unless one is an idiot, will know are done some intention to shape up certain public opinions etc.

So to sum up, people have not been informed fully about the process behind the sentences, which has big influence on their welfare.
Regardless of whether the sentence was unjust or not, there was clear lack of transparency in the whole juridical process. Now that is clearly immoral. To argue otherwise, is just purely ignorant.
Secondly, because we do not have not been informed of the basis used by the judiciary to determine sentences, we can only speculate about the severity of guilty and the appropriateness of sentences.
My speculation is that, which I will not mention again as I have mentioned in the past, there was no basis to begin with.
If there was, then my word, I sincerely question the intellectual capacity of one of the highest official in the whole Italia. The inability to distinguish various parties involved in the whole scandal and that the club is just a legal entity, and complete ignorance of the notion of responsibility and capacity - such imbecile should not be a judge regardless of the technical process behind the trial.
Oh yeah, it would take quite an argument to convince me that somehow a 8point penalty in a Juve less championship and participation in CL for Milan constitute as a penalty. What did Milan exactly loose? They normally beat Inter by that margin if not more most of the season. Even if Inter doesnt find way to self-distruct to loose 8 point gap, Milan will surely win a CL place next year taking into consideration that Lazio, Fiorentina will be busy fighting relegation and Juve will be in Serie B.
Forget about us, Fiorentina, & Lazio. Milan has definetely CHEATED. THAT IS A FACT. Now can YOU say that is a penalty? If guilty, team should be penalized.

so, when is Juventus hiring you as their new lawyer ???


and I'm not kidding !!!

 

[ßöмßäяðîëя]

All the way up to the People's Court with Judge Wapner, bro.

So I'll take that as a yes?

 

[The Pado]

All the way up to the People's Court with Judge Wapner, bro.

Did you just call me a "Wapner"?

 

[d.nico]

How the hell did u get soo much money in ur bank? Donate some tu Juve man!

or atleast me...

If with this money i can bribe the judge for Juve, i'll give all my money.

if you're the judge then...