Fabio Grosso DONE DEAL (135 Viewers)

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Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
Mar 16, 2004
111,704
Funny you would mention Baldini, because WE DID try to hire him after Calciopoli and he was vehemently against going anywhere near Juve, especially in that state (spefically said its a bad place to go in those circumstances), anyone who has better job options would be reluctant, but confirmed that Baldini refused. Its not like Secco was hired as first choice, even if he was someone who was groomed for the role in beforehand.
Well, then I was wrong about Baldini the Romanista. It happens sometimes.

I just don't buy nobody would want to go to Juve when people actually did. It's neither an argument that can be proven or should be used because it makes no sense.
 

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Osman

Koul Khara!
Aug 30, 2002
59,324
The problem is this: you nor I have any proof that nobody else would have wanted to join Juventus in Secco's position after the scandal hit.

The only proof we have is that Blanc and Gigli joined Juventus in directing roles once Calciopoli surfaced, facts that do not provide much support to your arguments.
Let me ask you something, if after the Enron scandal, they put up ads advertising for openings in directorial positions, do you think they would have many applicants?

More simple, if that isnt enough: Why would people who can get on other ships, get on a sinking ship?
 

Cronios

Juventolog
Jun 7, 2004
27,412
The club notices he is doing well.
Did he do well last year? Or the previous one? Why wasnt he replaced in June?? Couldnt we have a proper transfer managers after securing CL, rank 2nd looking good for this year too and have about 50-60mil to spend and so many players to cash in ex-change?

And arent any professionals out there who can do a whole lot better than him?? Why should we keep on with half measures??
Secco didnt do anything spectacular after all! He only paid the money we gave him, paying the max fee at most cases and made minimum income from our sales/loans.
 

Snoop

Sabet is a nasty virgin
Oct 2, 2001
28,186
Let me ask you something, if after the Enron scandal, they put up ads advertising for openings in directorial positions, do you think they would have many applicants?

More simple, if that isnt enough: Why would people who can get on other ships, get on a sinking ship?
Juve never was a sinking ship! Yeah heavy punishments, but no one doubted about Juve's abilities and strength! Tough job maybe, but not an impossible one. Where the hell is Baldini the fag now? In a better club than current Juve's? I don't think so..
 
Sep 1, 2002
12,745
I actually LOVE such posts, i rarely ever get any arguments to work with!!


- Bla bla bla, apart from the drama, i agree that Secco, was thrown to the wolves and it wasnt his fault!

But the part when you assume that no one wanted Secco's job, was totally wrong, this could be the case for the first year, but right after we were cleansed,
right after we demonstrated that we can still compete in serie and still have a loads of cash and prestige to work with.
Right after we ripped off all ties to the previous Juve, those managers would never ever have a problem to join us.
Because they knew what was really going on and because they knew that Moggi wasnt the only doing what he did.

We never even tried to tempt any of them to our side, not even foreigners, not even assistants. The ONLY reason because we didnt got any one else, is because WE didnt wanted it!! We trusted Secco of being one of us, some thing goes with the others that are still on helm. Dont expect us to believe that so many years after calciopoli, we still cant find a proper man for the job.

We have just demonstrated what i have been saying all along and this is why our problem was never dealt! They should be replaced asap, as soon as they proved their incompetence and we had the chance to upgrade!

-We are supposed to be a competitive club, we are supposed to compete with the best out there. This scandal brought far too many steps back, we cannot afford sidesteps or even worse backsteps.
There is absolutely no good reason, not to at least try do better than that!
There is a specific reason those specific pawns are tolerated on this specific positions! Whatever it is, it has nothing to do with their competence!

-For every line you may have on Moggi, others can write a book on Secco!!
Losing Kaka when he was nothing, is not nearly as bad as losing Mutu when we did. Overpaying for Vieira is not nearly as bad, as it overpaying for Tiago.
Mistakes are always bound to happen, but once in a while we expect a few good transfers too. Being in our darkest hours, spending the money we did and having an imperative team to be optimal to our decisions, demands far better results than the usual.
Since that was almost impossible, we should at least try to equal our previous efficiency. We have always have had less resources and political/media influence,
we could only cope with the best, only because of our exceptional management.
Thats why we were labeled a company. This is how the game is played.
Our political and our financial status has been enhanced and cant be enhanced!
All we can do, is to increase our managerial efficiency to the highest competitive levels.

-What exactly makes it damn good transfer campaign???
The names?? Doesnt the transfer campaign also include the names we lost?? (Criscito too)
Doesnt include the amount we have paid for those names?
Doesnt this transfer campaign includes our priorities? (fullbacks)
Or is it just about the fancy names, no matter what the cost???

-Secco's mistakes cost us 50mil (give or go)
Who is held responsible for that money?? It should all just go away like that??
Who is held responsible for Tiago locking our president on the toilet and then force us to pay his salary and bonuses??
Who is held responsible that we are forced to loan Almiron and pay a part of his salary too, until the day he is released and lose the last penny we paid for him?
Who he is held responsible that Genoa had a clause to keep Criscito and then buy his contract so cheap? When we are still struggling to find a half decent replacement until the last transfer day?

-They were not stolen but thrown away, for one player Secco got, he released 3 bargain chips first. We used to have a far large of players to gamble with, or at least loan and retain some short of influence between other serie A teams, just like the other big teams. One reason we were forced to release them was financial, but one more reasons is that Secco couldnt handle them, as he was losing money with almost any kind of transaction he was involved with...
It remains to be seen if this strategy will give us strategic advantage, or the other way around...

-Neither Secco's !!! It is the limited money our club had and with that we could have covered some wholes that really really hurt us!
Exactly because we dont have Real's money to spend, this is why we cant afford to overpay as they did and should be extra careful to our choices!
We have been pushed over from lesser clubs and players:cry:
Those money are a responsibility and if Secco is not able to take care of it, he should better quit!! Or at least stop boasting like an idiot...
We are not a playground for young managers, we cannot afford to lose by their mistakes.
Such experiments do multiple damage in our level, thats why such managers should be trained at smaller clubs, where their mistakes are a few millions less painful and the competitiveness level far more forgiving!
Today, that is practically no reason to take such a huge risk!
I will say they were equally hard, I mean if we had win the league, I would have agreed with you totally. Fiorentina didn't have a serie A squad when they were promoted, but brought in loads of quality players and build the appropriate squad to compete for the CL spot (That's what Fiorentina is about no? to win that spot) and they made it very fast, and the good thing for them, they are still in a good financial statue, and still have competitive squad and playing in serie A! That's not a thing to underrate. We had Serie A squad in Serie B, with champions and more than a decent players. Anyway, I don't disagree much here with you.



Man I am not saying we didn't need players, all I am saying we overpaid them, and not couple of millions, but maybe even the double of their worth. I mean maybe Moggi couldn't believe the money he got for Zizou, and for that he went nuts in the market, that's how I see his action. 120 Million!!

Yeah I hate that too about Ancelotti's departure, he was unlucky but looked very promising.
Big ifs:

If it hadn't rained
If the ref, then, hadn't been persuaded
If Zizou had stayed
If Buffon had been bought that season
If Carlo had been trusted
If Moggi had not thought Agnelli would not die
 

Ahmed

Principino
Sep 3, 2006
47,928
Juve never was a sinking ship! Yeah heavy punishments, but no one doubted about Juve's abilities and strength!
a lot of people thought it would take Juve ages to recover from the Calciopoli rulings...it is quite frankly amazing to see us do so well in such a short amount of time
 

Alen

Ѕenior Аdmin
Apr 2, 2007
52,574
Did he do well last year? Or the previous one? Why wasnt he replaced in June??
And arent professionals out there who can do a whole lot better than him??
We're not owned by one magnat who can do whatever he wants and single handedly choose who to buy.

I don't think that Secco, or anyone else in Juve, is choosing the transfer targets alone.

There is a team, where the coach is included too, that decides who to buy, what's the maximum we can spend on that player, etc.

Secoo is the guy who should make that transfer happen. His job is to lower the price and to convince the clubs and the players to join us. Also, his job is to get as much more possible from the players we're selling

Now, you already criticised Secco for overpaying and selling cheaply. I won't get into this debate and i won't disagree with you.

But i do believe that you're wrong blaming Secco for buying Tiago, Poulsen, Almiron etc, because that surely wasn't his own decision. At least 3 more people made the decision to buy these players.
 

Stephan

Senior Member
Nov 9, 2005
16,398
Juve never was a sinking ship! Yeah heavy punishments, but no one doubted about Juve's abilities and strength! Tough job maybe, but not an impossible one. Where the hell is Baldini the fag now? In a better club than current Juve's? I don't think so..
Baldini is assistant manager for England. Actually his been Capello`s sidekick since Capello left us for Real.
 

Cronios

Juventolog
Jun 7, 2004
27,412
a lot of people thought it would take Juve ages to recover from the Calciopoli rulings...it is quite frankly amazing to see us do so well in such a short amount of time
It seems we have underestimated the impact it had on the other Italians teams.
As for the rest, they were simply underestimated us.

But we are still a long long way of fielding a competitive team, like Juve used to be...
 

Bjerknes

"Top Economist"
Mar 16, 2004
111,704
Let me ask you something, if after the Enron scandal, they put up ads advertising for openings in directorial positions, do you think they would have many applicants?

More simple, if that isnt enough: Why would people who can get on other ships, get on a sinking ship?
Enron is a much more complicated issue that involved several charges among liquidity and capital concerns. They became defunct shortly after.

Why would Blanc and Gigli, especially the former, join a sinking ship? The guy is not necessarily an idiot when it comes to business.

I mean, it's not like the club was going to disband or be barred from competition. Although I do understand why some would opt to avoid the club.

Some of the smartest businessmen/investors buy stocks that nobody wants to touch. Warren Buffett is one. Even though we had legal problems, it's not like the stock was close to bankruptcy.
 

Ahmed

Principino
Sep 3, 2006
47,928
It seems we have underestimated the impact it had on the other Italians teams.
As for the rest, they were simply underestimated us.

But we are still a long long way of fielding a competitive team, like Juve used to be...
even that team you're referring to took a lot of time to build, and those too in the the good days...one must appreciate how well the current mgmt. has done in creating the current team, which is quite close to the 05/06 squad, and that too from such difficult circumstances
 

JCK

Biased
JCK
May 11, 2004
123,580
a lot of people thought it would take Juve ages to recover from the Calciopoli rulings...it is quite frankly amazing to see us do so well in such a short amount of time
Not according to Cronios though, the man with the facts and dare admit "reality".
 

Snoop

Sabet is a nasty virgin
Oct 2, 2001
28,186
Baldini is assistant manager for England. Actually his been Capello`s sidekick since Capello left us for Real.
yeah! That's not a biggie, being in the head of a club like current Juventus would have been a much bigger step to a better career. And that's not only to the Baldini fag, to all who were scared to have a job like this!
 

Nicholas

MIRKO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Jan 30, 2008
38,737
I really cannot understand some of these posts. Alot of people contradicting themselves. Cronios its cleary personal with your fixation with Secco, we have heard the same bullshit for the past 3 years. The Board and Secco have brought us two exciting players in Melo and Diego. Aslong as there over Juventus football club they have my full support. We are not in debt, we make exciting purchases and we have a brand new stadium on the way. Quite frankly the future is looking bright for a Juventini.
 

Ahmed

Principino
Sep 3, 2006
47,928
yeah! That's not a biggie, being in the head of a club like current Juventus would have been a much bigger step to a better career. And that's not only to the Baldini fag, to all who were scared to have a job like this!
he hasn't exactly struggled either, has he? Madrid and then the England NT? seems like the guy has done well for himself
 
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