[EU] Champions League 06/07 (24 Viewers)

[Azzurri7]

I did , inderectly.


That would be me i supose.
I admit i started supporting Juve as a gloryhunter. I wasn't even 17 and i was only symphatizing Juve when they played Ajax in 1996. Then i started loving them. They played gorgeous football, they were the best, it was easy to love Juve.

But my Juve lost 3 cl finals after that. My Juve was out of cl in 2000, my Juve was sent to serie B and i still love them, even more then when they were hammering everybody.

So no, i didn't start following Juve 1 week ago.

I know you for more than 3 years Rab. Don't look at my join date, i do know you.
You love Juve, i know. But you love Del Piero more than you love Juve. Everyone who knows you knows that. You didn't hate Zlatan because he was bad, you hated him because Del Piero was a bench player in Zlatans time. You didn't hate Capello because Juve was suffering because of him, you hated him because he preffered Zlatan.
The kids here hated Zlatan because it was cool to be Zlatan hater. The others didn't like Zlatan because he was hurting Juve, but your reason for hating him was different - he took your idol's place.
So yes, you love Juve with passion but it's only because you'd kill for Del Piero.
And yes, if it wasn't for Del Piero you'd have been a Milan fan.

Good post.

Though I'm going to disagree with you on couple of things here.

Yes, I couldn't stand both Zlatan and Capello for many reasons and one of them is Del Piero. You're spot on here, but thats not the only reason... I guess, i've expressed why do I think Zlatan is an overrated player and the same goes with Capello.

Love Del Piero more than Juve? Thats not true man.....I probably cant prove it to you, time will.

And I never thought of being a Milan fan, and never will. I'm happy with the team I support, I feel honored each year I buy couple of Jerseys, I feel passionat each time I watch them play. I think I'll remain like this even when Del Piero will retire.

 

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[Azzurri7]

What did you try to achieve with that? I'll let your favourite "buddy", Azzurri7, reply to that. Oh sorry, he agrees to everything you say.

What is with the Azzurri now? is it because i'm trying not to enter in any silly argument with you, you're bringing me into this?

How can I help you Jack?

 

[JCK]

What is with the Azzurri now? is it because i'm trying not to enter in any silly argument with you, you're bringing me into this?

How can I help you Jack?

No man, I didn't mean it like that. It was because of a cheap attempt from him to bring out the situation in Lebanon, where you are also concerned. I wasn't at all trying to bring you in this argument, you have way more class than Andy has. int:

I'll +rep you

 

[The Arif]

But you love Del Piero more than you love Juve

Love Juve more than Del Piero? Thats not true man.....I probably cant prove it to you, time will.

Rab, I think you just proved his point.

 

[Azzurri7]

Rab, I think you just proved his point.

You got me there. I'll fix that

 

[Alen]

Yes your example correct in so far as to prove why team must consistently play better to maintain their status. I was thinking more of statistical adjustment of raw scores, by taking into consideration the respective position of different leagues. In essence, a point earned by an Italian may not same as those by France, or Germany. From what I remember, Erik showed such statistical adjustment do exist, thus requiring big 3 to perform far above the chasing pack if they intend to keep their status; but I may be wrong here.

Yes man, that's what i'm trying to tell you from the beggining.

Juve wins and gets 2 points for the win
Dinamo Zagreb wins and gets 2 points for the win

But there are 7 italian teams in europe and the 2 points Juve got are divided with 7, so Juve gives 0.285 points to Italy with this win.
And there are only 3 Croatian teams so the 2 points Dinamo Zagreb got are divided with 3 and Dinamo, with this win, gives 0.666 points to Croatia.

That's why Italian teams need to get many more wins than Croatian teams

 

[lavenderguy]

I didn´t see people complaining when we had the allmighty Italian final with Juventus and Milan. But it would be the end of the world if 2 clubs from EPL played a final, wouldn´t it? Talking about Englishmen being biased.

How pathetic....

Mark you are my man!

I will watch the final but won;t be rooting for any side, i just want a grand finale, that's all....
I wish it's Juventus vs Barca in the final..w DP scoring and lifting the big ears..
How long should I have to wait for that to happen?
CL either can make you or break you, look at Leeds man!!

 

[Lawnchair Bes]

rab, this guy has got you all figured out

 

[HelterSkelter]

Is there really a need to prove to the outside world how big a Juventus fan a person is?We all know who we support,and a few 'You are not a true Juventus fan' or 'A Juventus fan should cheer for some team' jibes wont really change that.I dont think a person who was cheering for Milan and Roma agaisnt Manchester United is a lesser Juventus fan than someone who wasnt,but hey,who really cares what the other person thinks as long as you're at peace with yourself?

 

[tassard]

Is there really a need to prove to the outside world how big a Juventus fan a person is?We all know who we support,and a few 'You are not a true Juventus fan' or 'A Juventus fan should cheer for some team' jibes wont really change that.I dont think a person who was cheering for Milan and Roma agaisnt Manchester United is a lesser Juventus fan than someone who wasnt,but hey,who really cares what the other person thinks as long as you're at peace with yourself?

Great post

 

[Marc]

Damn! I missed all the fun! Great discussion guys, and special compliments to Jacques, Xcen3x, Vidocq, Snoop, Seven, Bbilan and Rami.

The rest of you just disappointed me. However, I now know how to behave in this forum and I know when the time comes to celebrate Juventus glory again this will not be a place for it. I´ll find this passion elsewhere.

 

[Marc]

Were you on the forums that time?

No, I wasn´t. However it didn´t cross your mind that I can read old threads, didn´t it?

Btw I am here longer than you think. I just didn´t register earlier.

 

[Jun-hide]

Yes man, that's what i'm trying to tell you from the beggining.

Juve wins and gets 2 points for the win
Dinamo Zagreb wins and gets 2 points for the win

But there are 7 italian teams in europe and the 2 points Juve got are divided with 7, so Juve gives 0.285 points to Italy with this win.
And there are only 3 Croatian teams so the 2 points Dinamo Zagreb got are divided with 3 and Dinamo, with this win, gives 0.666 points to Croatia.

That's why Italian teams need to get many more wins than Croatian teams

Of course, if you got more teams then you have win more, there is nothing mysterious about that adjustment. But simply dividing the raw score in to averages won't adjust the difficulty level on "per capita" basis. And the matter of fact is, a fourth team teams like Fiorentina, Liverpool, Sevilla are more likely to score higher points than say Dinamo, or Stella Rosa. Hence, I somewhat doubt lower seeds from big nations are going to bring the averages down drastically. What more, those teams have seven or 8 teams participating in Europe so a single team's performances are less likely to have big impact on overall co-efficient, meaning bias likely to entrenched big time if you don't adjust the raw scores.

May be UEFA has those statistical adjustment or maybe they don't. From what I recall, they did. But I might be wrong. In anycase, the simply raw score method is deeply flawed even though I won't go into the details about it.

 

[denco]

I have not had the time to read thru all the posts on here but the common theme at 1 time seemed to be if you support another Italian team other than Juve against another team from another country then something is wrong with you. I have to ask those who are suggesting that , how do you watch a match between 2 teams and stay completely neutral? If you can do that then you are not human as its almost impossible to do. 1 part of u will want 1 team to win more than then other and the fact most ppl here will support an Italian team should not be judged as a betrayal but a case of better the devil you know
For the match
Ambrosini was excellent unusually
Pirlo was magnificent
Seedorf was magnificent
Kaka was supreme
Gatusso was out of this world and
Gilardino scored
Meaning Manu were hopeless
Ronaldo was awful with tricks that did not belong and to do it in the first seconds of a match was lunacy
Rooney was alarmingly bad as was Giigs
Defence what defence?

 

[x-japan]

-Do u guys realize that the way Milan go to the final is similar with Juve's in 02/03 season :-?

 

[Seven]

You mean they won games?

 

[Gill_juve]

This is called: "الصيد في الماء العكر"

Don't bother asking me what it means, I cannot think of a translation. Its for the Arabic literate people over here.

?:confused2

 

[x-japan]

-@Seven: of course, but there're more than that, just review the way both team go to the final
+ have to finish a match in extra time (juve-barca, milan-celtic)
+ have to face a strong, highly-rated opponent in the semi who just have a domination win (real-mu 6-3, mu-roma 8-3)
+ and this is the most similar point, the way both team score 3 goal:
first goal: Alex head back, Trez volley - Seedorf head back, Kaka volley
second goal: Alex fool Real's defence and finish cooly, Seedorf did the same
third goal: an excellent counter-attack

 

[Omair]

I have not had the time to read thru all the posts on here but the common theme at 1 time seemed to be if you support another Italian team other than Juve against another team from another country then something is wrong with you. I have to ask those who are suggesting that , how do you watch a match between 2 teams and stay completely neutral? If you can do that then you are not human as its almost impossible to do. 1 part of u will want 1 team to win more than then other and the fact most ppl here will support an Italian team should not be judged as a betrayal but a case of better the devil you know
For the match
Ambrosini was excellent unusually
Pirlo was magnificent
Seedorf was magnificent
Kaka was supreme
Gatusso was out of this world and
Gilardino scored
Meaning Manu were hopeless
Ronaldo was awful with tricks that did not belong and to do it in the first seconds of a match was lunacy
Rooney was alarmingly bad as was Giigs
Defence what defence?

Excuse me, I was completely neutral .. some part of me didn't want Milan to be the champions because the rivalry thing and the other part didn't want an all English final "not because the italian glory. NO, just for the final not to be utterly boring" ...sum the opposites up that would give my neutral stance ..

If you were watching the game with me .. you'd hear this "Ronaldo you moron don't keep the ball that much .." and a minute later you'd hear "Damn you Kaka you play so good .. just pass the ball to Seedorf .. Yep that's how you do it" ..

Does it sound weird to you ?? I just enjoyed the game for the sake of the game ...

Still I get disgusted of Juve fans cheering for Milan .. and I also felt weird that my Arsenal fan friend was cheering for Man Utd ..

Now the part of me that didn't want an all English final is satisfied but the other part is like HELL NO NOT MILAN ... *&^%! those bastards ...

 

[Rami]

On what planet is this guy living on?

terry col may 3
Published: Thu, May 3, 2007

REGULAR readers will know that I am unashamedly ABU (Anyone but United), but I have a confession to make – I cheered the Red Devils to their 3-2 victory over AC Milan in the home first leg of the UEFA Champions League semi-final last week.

Not because they gave Johnny Foreigner a bloody nose with Wayne Rooney's late goal, but, as I had, since the last four 2007 contenders were known, consigned my prejudices to the back burner to stand by my principles.

I installed the three Barclays Premiership clubs that claimed semi-final berths as 'keepers of the flame', protectors of the beautiful game, a game only last summer so gravely tarnished by Italian corruption and tagged in some quarters 'rotten to the core'.

Isn't it true what they say about time being a great healer and isn't it also true how time slips away and how easily we forget? Forget that AC Milan had initially been banned from the Champions League following the Serie A match-fixing outrage!

In addition to disbarment the runners up to Juventus in Italy's 2005/2006 campaign were handicapped by deduction of 15 points as they began the present season. On appeal the penalty was mitigated – an eight-point deduction and Champions League re-instatement into the third qualifying round where they defeated Red Star Belgrade 3-1 on aggregate.

Juventus were stripped of their 2005 and 2006 titles (Scudettos), evicted from the Champions League and, on appeal, relegated to Serie B (instead of Serie C1) and had to contend with a nine-point deduction this term (instead of 30). They paid dearly, missing out on Europe's premier club tourney this year and next.

AC Milan, meanwhile, prospered in the Champions League, while not faring so well back home.They currently languish ninth in Serie A, 30 points adrift of bitter rivals Internazionale after 20 games. A belated come-uppance is on the cards as they look likely to fail to qualify for the 2007/2008 Champions League.

And if you think it has all gone away and that Italy has cleaned up its act then think again.In a recent crackdown the Italian Referees Association suspended seven referees and two assistant referees as the latest match-fixing scandal hit the headlines.Naples magistrates also named 48 people suspected of wrongdoing.

So, no, I don't want AC Milan to win the Champions League, thank you very much. Who knows the truth of how they qualified if the game in Italy is, as it is appearing to become, a 'cheaters charter'.

Like all genuine sportsmen and women I have no time for cheats. That's a principle worth adhering to, prejudices notwithstanding, and so I was pleased for all United fans last Tuesday.I hope your team completed the job last night.

My other principle in all of this is the travesty of the championship name, also well known through this column. Recently the Times Sports Writer of the Year, Martin Samuels admitted, "after all these years it still sticks in the craw".

AC Milan were not champions of their country and would not have got my 2007 winners' vote anyway. No one but Chelsea - the only surviving national champions – would have. Yes, just one of the four semi-finalists were champions of their country, and only three reached the quarter-finals from the seven included in the last 16.

Of clubs in the last eight AS Roma, routed 8-3 on aggregate by Fergie's boys, finished a massive 22 points behind Juventus, serving to put that 8-3 United victory into some kind of perspective. AC Milan had been only three points in arrears.

Valencia, ousted by Chelsea in the quarter-finals, were 13 points short of champions, Barcelona in Spain, but statistics in the round of the last 16 are even more damning – Arsenal 24 in arrears of Chelsea in 2005/2006, Lille 22 behind French champions Lyon, Internazionale 15 adrift of Juventus and Read Madrid trailing 12 in the footsteps of Barcelona.

Add into the mix that Chievo were Italy's fourth representatives and that they finished a lowly seventh in Serie A last season and will someone please explain how the greatest annual football show on earth has any claim to be called European CHAMPIONS League.

http://www.nwipp-newspapers.com/UH/free/301532151751589.php