Andrea Pirlo (66 Viewers)

[Rollie]

I don't think we'd be having this conversation if we won the CL last year. If that had happened, I think most would consider Andrea a club legend.

Regardless, the entire story of how Andrea came to Juventus, how he played at such a high level while being an older player, how he was the focal point on a team that had been in a historically bad period before he arrived and helped lead the biggest club in Italy to one of the most successful periods in its nearly 120 year history... for me, all of that creates a legendary story.

That would definitely be a positive step.

It would be legendary, wouldn't it

Or maybe drop an upperdecker in Berlusconi's private washroom?

Baggio is a Juve legend though. He played for a few teams but his best was here.

Just curious, Jay, but is that actually the Mods criteria? Your 'best' years have to be with the club? So is it kind of what Napoleonic said, you can only be a legend for 1 club -- unless your name is Zidane? Who was more productive, and won bigger trophies in Madrid?

Vialli was a world record transfer, bit of an opposite situation to Zidane, in that he may have had his best years at Samp, but won the big one with Juve.

Nah, being a legend is about time, not success.

Ravanelli (4), Vialli (4), and Boniek (3) are all included on "The Walk", though. (all 3 do have a CL title).

If Juventus were about to open the stadium, say, next season, I wonder if we'd see Pirlo included on "The Walk"?

In that case Birindelli > Platini.

Well, there obviously has to be some success there as well

 

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[Seven]

Seriously though, not having Pirlo in the legends section is just plain wrong, imo. Why be stingy about it with a true legend of football, like Andrea?

4 years at the club, 4 Scudetti, Coppa, CL Final, and 3 consecutive years voted as Serie A Footballer of the year. Always an international, ofc. Before he arrived, back-to-back 7th place finishes. This was the player, more than any other player on the pitch, who dictated our team's play. He was elemental on the pitch, and fundamental in dragging the club back to respectability.

Also a total class act, a great leader on and off the pitch, and a role model for basically everyone involved with football. Andrea was a HUGE coup, still hard to believe we got him for free.

What's missing for him to be considered a legend here? Does he need to give all of the mods a handy? Take a dump on the doormat of the San Siro? Is a CL title required for legend status on the forum? Or did he just need to play a 5th season, to complete some arbitrary criteria?

Why the fuck does it matter so much to you?

 

[Rollie]

Why the fuck does it matter so much to you?

Easy, tough guy.

Nothing that happens around here really matters to me, Seven.

It's an internet forum, dude. Just presenting an argument, and making a bit of conversation.

 

[Seven]

Easy, tough guy.

Nothing that happens around here really matters to me, Seven.

It's an internet forum, dude. Just presenting an argument, and making a bit of conversation.

But isn't the answer sort of obvious? Pirlo will always be more of a Milan man. Sure, he was instrumental. And yes, for whatever weird reason the world suddenly recognised just how great he was when he finally joined us. But in reality his best games were for Milan.

 

[Rollie]

But isn't the answer sort of obvious? Pirlo will always be more of a Milan man. Sure, he was instrumental. And yes, for whatever weird reason the world suddenly recognised just how great he was when he finally joined us. But in reality his best games were for Milan.

But that's what I was asking. What is the criteria for the mods on the thread labeling. Which Jay kind of explained.

Yes, his best years were for Milan, it's just that he was so crucial for Juve's resurgence. I also know the league is a bit diminished, and the award is modern, but being named the best player in the league 3/4 seasons he was here is legendary stuff -- particularly when the team won the league every year he was here. That is exceptional, and exceedingly rare -- which is kind of what legend criteria is made from, imo. Exceptional and exceedingly rare accomplishments.

If it were for an induction ceremony into, say, a hall of fame (baseball, for example), then I get that a player goes in wearing the cap of one team (which the player chooses).

This is a bit different, but like I said, doesn't really matter to me. I was just curious about the process.

For me, he's a Juve legend, regardless of what Tuz thinks.

 

[Ventus]

Pirlo is a Juve legend in my opinion. Not only because of winning all those league titles, which he won more here than he did at Milan btw, but because of his importance of Juve's revival. Also Pirlo became a fantastic advertisement for Juventus, he made people across the globe want to tune in and watch Juve again. People in England fell in love with this guy, they even had his book sold in your local bookstore, and Pirlo became a symbol for juve here.

With that said many Milan fans debate whether he's a Milan legend anymore anyway, because of the swipes he has took of them in his book. But I do believe a player can be legend at both clubs, so long as he doesn't clearly portray the support for one of them over the other.

 

[Suns]

Pirlo is a legend that played for Juve, not a Juve legend.

 

[Rollie]

 

[napoleonic]

On a further thought, it's complicated anyway

Is there anyone that consider batigol as a roma legend? But he's obviously worshipped in florence

What about that brazillian ronaldo? Is he a barca legend? Or madrid's? Or even merda's? Or is he neither?

 

[Zacheryah]

What did batistuta do at roma, is he remembered for it

Ronaldo brazil's legend, not bound to a team

 

[Rollie]

It is a bit complicated in the hearts of fans, particularly when the other club is despised/reviled -- the way Milan generally is by Juve fans.

I just think that when a player does something unprecedented like Andrea did -- and to my knowledge, no other player in the history of Calcio has won 3 consecutive MVP awards, while winning 4 consecutive titles (correct me if I'm wrong, anyone) -- it's just sounds strange to say they're not a legend for that team. Especially if they're a fundamental reason for returning that team to respectability. I mean, many "legends" of club football go their entire careers without collecting that much silverware.

Batistuta and Ronaldo are interesting examples, but a little different, as Andrea did play nearly twice as many games for Juve as Bati did for Roma, or Ronaldo did for anyone other than Madrid.

Earlier, I was trying to think of other footballers who have been legitimate legends for multiple teams, but was drawing a blank. They're out there!

Hockey is another story, and I can think of a few (Gretzky, Messier, Roy... others like B. Hull, Howe, and Bourque are all hall of famers who have had their jerseys retired by multiple clubs).

Anyway, I'll stop now

 

[napoleonic]

What did batistuta do at roma, is he remembered for it

Ronaldo brazil's legend, not bound to a team

Batigol won scudetto with roma, remember? He never achieved it at florence, also consider how many times roma won scudetti

 

[Alex-444]

[video=dailymotion;x3np0gp]http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x3np0gp[/video]

 

[Hist]

But isn't the answer sort of obvious? Pirlo will always be more of a Milan man. Sure, he was instrumental. And yes, for whatever weird reason the world suddenly recognised just how great he was when he finally joined us. But in reality his best games were for Milan.

He did more to us than he did to Milan. He completely resurrected Juve from the gutters and left us with almost a treble. In Milan he was just another top player in a great squad. The Pirlo signing will always be Marotta's master stroke and Milan's greatest mistake. We had no money and needed a good midfielder. We got the best midfielder in the world as a free gift from Milan We needed a miracle to get back to dominance and he was that miracle. Probably saved us a 40-50 million transfer fee to get a midfielder that could make the team tick.

 

[sallyinzaghi]

Why cant he be both a milan and juve legend? Thats a testament to the player he is

 

[rndmlgnd]

He did more to us than he did to Milan. He completely resurrected Juve from the gutters and left us with almost a treble. In Milan he was just another top player in a great squad. The Pirlo signing will always be Marotta's master stroke and Milan's greatest mistake. We had no money and needed a good midfielder. We got the best midfielder in the world as a free gift from Milan We needed a miracle to get back to dominance and he was that miracle. Probably saved us a 40-50 million transfer fee to get a midfielder that could make the team tick.

"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Hist again."

 

[Hist]

Why cant he be both a milan and juve legend? Thats a testament to the player he is

In my books, a player who has served the club exceptionally well for years and was a key player in many trophies (let alone THE key player for coming out of the gutter) and left the club on very good terms is a legend of that club. If he did the same at two or even three other clubs I see no reason why he should not be a legend there too. Eitherway he speaks better of us than of Milan. In his worst season for us we almost did the treble while he was in the starting 11 and he provided key memorable moments both in the league (Torino comes to mind) and in the CL (Olmypiakos) without ever being terrible for 4 years.

Setting the minimum number of years a player has to spend to 5 instead of 4 or 6 is very arbitrary in my view. In terms of the quality of his service he is in a world of his own and 4 years is a full contract.

 

[Post Ironic]

It is a bit complicated in the hearts of fans, particularly when the other club is despised/reviled -- the way Milan generally is by Juve fans.

I just think that when a player does something unprecedented like Andrea did -- and to my knowledge, no other player in the history of Calcio has won 3 consecutive MVP awards, while winning 4 consecutive titles (correct me if I'm wrong, anyone) -- it's just sounds strange to say they're not a legend for that team. Especially if they're a fundamental reason for returning that team to respectability. I mean, many "legends" of club football go their entire careers without collecting that much silverware.

Batistuta and Ronaldo are interesting examples, but a little different, as Andrea did play nearly twice as many games for Juve as Bati did for Roma, or Ronaldo did for anyone other than Madrid.

Earlier, I was trying to think of other footballers who have been legitimate legends for multiple teams, but was drawing a blank. They're out there!

Hockey is another story, and I can think of a few (Gretzky, Messier, Roy... others like B. Hull, Howe, and Bourque are all hall of famers who have had their jerseys retired by multiple clubs).

Anyway, I'll stop now

Cristiano will probably be a ManU and Real Madrid legend. There's one.

Coaches are often legends for multiple teams. Trap was a legend as a Milan player and as a Juve manager.

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Pirlo is absolutely a Juve legend. He was the biggest piece of the puzzle that returned us to dominating Serie A with 4 straight titles.

 

[pavluska]

Pirlo and Zizou definitely are Juve legends. I'm surprised that so many seem to think otherwise.

And if it has to be Milan or Juve, Pirlo likes Juve more and detests some of the things at Milan. A lot of Milanisti also turned on Pirlo and don't like him anymore these days.

Reading some of the Zidane comments made me feel old-ish. Even if you didn't have the opportunity to see Zidane as a Bianconero live (as opposed to on youtube), he's a Juve player every Juventino should have a good knowledge of. He was absolutely a legend in our shirt. Zidane 1999-2001 is the best player I've seen playing for Juve.

 

[Zacheryah]

Pirlo and Zizou definitely are Juve legends. I'm surprised that so many seem to think otherwise.

And if it has to be Milan or Juve, Pirlo likes Juve more and detests some of the things at Milan. A lot of Milanisti also turned on Pirlo and don't like him anymore these days.

Reading some of the Zidane comments made me feel old-ish. Even if you didn't have the opportunity to see Zidane as a Bianconero live (as opposed to on youtube), he's a Juve player every Juventino should have a good knowledge of. He was absolutely a legend in our shirt. Zidane 1999-2001 is the best player I've seen playing for Juve.

82-85 Platini was easely better. Actually got to finals and won them, collecting 3 ballon d'or's on the way