Premier League 2019/20 (23 Viewers)
- Thread starter Mark
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Lol that's harsh, but Soyuncu does look like a better defender than Maguire. Funny how that works sometimes.
Btw what a partnership that could be with Demiral @Turk_Bianconero
Btw what a partnership that could be with Demiral @Turk_Bianconero
No, united went from signing players like di maria, schweinsteiger and sanchez who either didn't want to join in the first place, or were only coming for a final paycheck at the end of their careers, to signing players who are young or in their prime and are actually excited and hungry to come and play for the club because it is a big step up in their careers. Bringing in players with the right attitude is very important.
Have you actually compared rashford's goalscoring stats with welbeck's? Welbeck at end of 12/13 season (when he was rashford's age) = 19 career goals for united, if you want to include the goals for preston north end and sunderland during his loans it is 27 club goals, plus 8 for england. Rashford's club total = 64 plus 10 for england. So according to you a career total of 35 goals is ''the same'' as a career total of 74 goals
This season isn't even finished either, so rashford can pull even further ahead of where welbeck was at. So your claim that they have the same goalscoring record at the same age is way off. Rashford is far more talented than welbeck ever was.
Smalling and Jones better than Maguire??? You're having a laugh, smalling is an absolute donkey with the ball at his feet and kills passing moves out from the back, he is decent at defending but a liability in possession. He has benefited from playing in serie a because the tempo is slower. He doesn't even make the england squad anymore. Jones is just poor all round, he's not good at anything and has regressed massively from the potential he showed as a teenager. He is 5th choice centre back at united for a reason. Try to tell a room full of match going united fans that jones is better and they'll be straight on the phone to the nearest hospital to try and get you sectioned under the mental health act.
Wan Bissaka doesn't get lost positionally all the time, he has been excellent in big games against elite players. He has had sterling in his pocket this season, a player who has excellent movement and should be able to take advantage of a player with poor positioning. Things like positioning and anticipation improve with experience too, so he'll get better in those areas, he is still very young for a defender which people don't take into account. He needs to improve going forward but defensively he's already an excellent player.
Have you actually compared rashford's goalscoring stats with welbeck's? Welbeck at end of 12/13 season (when he was rashford's age) = 19 career goals for united, if you want to include the goals for preston north end and sunderland during his loans it is 27 club goals, plus 8 for england. Rashford's club total = 64 plus 10 for england. So according to you a career total of 35 goals is ''the same'' as a career total of 74 goals
This season isn't even finished either, so rashford can pull even further ahead of where welbeck was at. So your claim that they have the same goalscoring record at the same age is way off. Rashford is far more talented than welbeck ever was. Smalling and Jones better than Maguire??? You're having a laugh, smalling is an absolute donkey with the ball at his feet and kills passing moves out from the back, he is decent at defending but a liability in possession. He has benefited from playing in serie a because the tempo is slower. He doesn't even make the england squad anymore. Jones is just poor all round, he's not good at anything and has regressed massively from the potential he showed as a teenager. He is 5th choice centre back at united for a reason. Try to tell a room full of match going united fans that jones is better and they'll be straight on the phone to the nearest hospital to try and get you sectioned under the mental health act.
Wan Bissaka doesn't get lost positionally all the time, he has been excellent in big games against elite players. He has had sterling in his pocket this season, a player who has excellent movement and should be able to take advantage of a player with poor positioning. Things like positioning and anticipation improve with experience too, so he'll get better in those areas, he is still very young for a defender which people don't take into account. He needs to improve going forward but defensively he's already an excellent player.
Di Maria wasn't looking for a final pay check, his stint with PSG proves it. Schweinsteiger was still useful. And Falcao kind of redeemed himself for his first few seasons after.
All of these were ruined by United as opposed to the contrary. Putting the blame on them is funny since United's environment is essentially a black hole.
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Even Pogba. Ruined. Lol.
All of these were ruined by United as opposed to the contrary. Putting the blame on them is funny since United's environment is essentially a black hole.
- - - Updated - - -
Even Pogba. Ruined. Lol.
I didn't categorise Di Maria as one of the players looking for a final pay check, he was one of the ones that didn't want to come in the first place. Schweinsteiger was finished, his legs were gone and bayern knew it. Pep himself said that ''during the last three years he was never in good condition.'' Falcao i didn't mention, but he also flopped at chelsea, so blaming united's environment for him failing is a bit strange. He clearly took a while to find himself again after the serious injury.
Bruno Fernandes and Wan Bissaka are the only good signings (mainly just defends, but he does it well, give him his props). The others only thing you can say is they are excited and come with the right attitude. Can hardly say they have the necessary quality. The Maguire signing is a travesty, turnstile level agility and mediocre defender with good heading and decent leadership. Even if he was signed for 20-30m I would said this is not the signing Man U or any top team should make to elevate your defense. Being better then Smalling and Jones is not an achievement (and he is better then them, hyperbole to say otherwise), its the basic requirement of every mid level defender.
The fact Woodward still has his job is an absolute travesty. But hey, aslong as fans are happy these mediocre players are excited and have the right attitude, he isnt going anywhere.
The fact Woodward still has his job is an absolute travesty. But hey, aslong as fans are happy these mediocre players are excited and have the right attitude, he isnt going anywhere.
Schweinsteiger was the only one who was at the end of his career from those. You can count Falcao too, but he was a loan.
Di Maria has won at least one trophy every season of his career except....you guessed it - the year he spent at United. Double double G/A for him in that one season was terrible, now Daniel James is lapped up. Standards in the gutter.
Alexis was one of the most sought-after players in the world when he came. What about Zlatan, Mata, Matić? What about Borthwick-Jackson and all the other Pokemon that were hyped up coming through the academy that never amounted to anything?
If we're going by the logic of which policy has failed more, signing proven older players or those that "are actually excited and hungry to come and play for the club because it is a big step up in their careers", then the whole academy should be burned to the ground and never sign another player from smaller clubs.
Also, you mean to tell me Maguire, AWB and James are super excited to play in a club way over their heads while earning huge salaries and providing the bare minimum? Color me shocked. We've had our Amauris, Poulsens, Tiagos, Molinaros etc., we know the feeling.
Danny Welbeck 288 minutes per open play Manchester United goal
Rashford 251 minutes per open play Manchester United goal
Over their whole careers
- Heskey - 0.21 open play goals per game
- Welbeck - 0.22 open play goals per game
- Rashford - 0.27 open play goals per game.
Amazing what penalties, PR and a club lowering it's standards can do for a footballers reputation.
Smalling is without a shadow of a doubt a better player than Maguire right now. Especially when you take into account money and salaries, it's not close. Smalling and Jones finished a season conceding 28 goals only. Maguire can dream that.
You mean a room full of brainwashed people who are happy to give money to Glazers and boo anyone showing/doing/singing anything against them and the shitty manager on the bench would disagree with factual information?
Yes he does which is proven by the fact he lunges into so many tackles. Defenders who are aware of their surroundings and play sound defense don't average 3-4 tackles per game.
AWB is probably the one I would choose out of the 3 if I had to, but again, for 10m or so as depth in the squad, not for 50m. There's not a universe where he will ever justify that amount.
Di Maria has won at least one trophy every season of his career except....you guessed it - the year he spent at United. Double double G/A for him in that one season was terrible, now Daniel James is lapped up. Standards in the gutter.
Alexis was one of the most sought-after players in the world when he came. What about Zlatan, Mata, Matić? What about Borthwick-Jackson and all the other Pokemon that were hyped up coming through the academy that never amounted to anything?
If we're going by the logic of which policy has failed more, signing proven older players or those that "are actually excited and hungry to come and play for the club because it is a big step up in their careers", then the whole academy should be burned to the ground and never sign another player from smaller clubs.
Also, you mean to tell me Maguire, AWB and James are super excited to play in a club way over their heads while earning huge salaries and providing the bare minimum? Color me shocked. We've had our Amauris, Poulsens, Tiagos, Molinaros etc., we know the feeling.
Have you actually compared rashford's goalscoring stats with welbeck's? Welbeck at end of 12/13 season (when he was rashford's age) = 19 career goals for united, if you want to include the goals for preston north end and sunderland during his loans it is 27 club goals, plus 8 for england. Rashford's club total = 64 plus 10 for england. So according to you a career total of 35 goals is ''the same'' as a career total of 74 goals This season isn't even finished either, so rashford can pull even further ahead of where welbeck was at. So your claim that they have the same goalscoring record at the same age is way off. Rashford is far more talented than welbeck ever was.
This season isn't even finished either, so rashford can pull even further ahead of where welbeck was at. So your claim that they have the same goalscoring record at the same age is way off. Rashford is far more talented than welbeck ever was.
Rashford 251 minutes per open play Manchester United goal
Over their whole careers
- Heskey - 0.21 open play goals per game
- Welbeck - 0.22 open play goals per game
- Rashford - 0.27 open play goals per game.
Amazing what penalties, PR and a club lowering it's standards can do for a footballers reputation.
Smalling is without a shadow of a doubt a better player than Maguire right now. Especially when you take into account money and salaries, it's not close. Smalling and Jones finished a season conceding 28 goals only. Maguire can dream that.
You mean a room full of brainwashed people who are happy to give money to Glazers and boo anyone showing/doing/singing anything against them and the shitty manager on the bench would disagree with factual information?
Yes he does which is proven by the fact he lunges into so many tackles. Defenders who are aware of their surroundings and play sound defense don't average 3-4 tackles per game.
AWB is probably the one I would choose out of the 3 if I had to, but again, for 10m or so as depth in the squad, not for 50m. There's not a universe where he will ever justify that amount.
I never said that Di Maria isn't a quality player, my point is he didn't want to join united in the first place. He was pressured into the move by madrid and his agent since united were the only club that put the money up. He wanted to go to psg at the time but they couldn't pay the money due to ffp problems, so his attitude coming in the door was wrong from the get go. That's why i said it is important to sign players that have the right attitude, it makes a big difference.
I predicted that sanchez would fail at united, he had clearly already lost a yard of pace at arsenal and already seen his best days. He joined united because they offered him stupid wages, not for footballing reasons. It was a big mistake simple as that. He has not performed like the old alexis sanchez at inter either, the physical deterioration is very evident.
Zlatan did well for united actually considering his age, he helped them to win two trophies and is considered a success by most united fans. Unfortunately he sustained a serious injury which ruined his second season at the club but that was just bad luck. Matic and Mata have just done ok, decent signings, they haven't flopped but haven't pulled up any trees either. I don't recall Borthwick-Jackson ever being hyped, he wasn't regarded as a special talent in the academy at all. Van Gaal was the only one that saw something in him.
Any policy will fail if bad decisions are made, dortmund have had a huge amount of success in signing and developing young players. I don't know why you are making it about the academy here, i'm not talking about signing players for the academy, i'm talking about first team signings. Signing young players has some advantages, they are not going to decline rapidly due to age, they may not be on massive wages initially, and they won't completely lose their market value and be almost impossible to get rid of. They also have the potential to improve and become more valuable. Signing older proven players in the late 20's range can work, but its more fraught with danger due to the cost involved these days and the possibility of a rapid decline. Look at how difficult it now is for united to get rid of sanchez.
It is only your perception that they are ''providing the bare minimum'', the reality is very different.
You didn't say anything about open play goals statistics in your initial comment. Penalties still need to be scored, so they still count, however lets subtract them anyway. Rashford in his united career has scored 11 penalties. Just to remind you, you said ''He has the same goalscoring record as Welbeck had at his age''. Even if you subtract penalties its still 35 for welbeck versus 63 for rashford, so you are still way off the mark, and you'll only be even more off the mark by the end of the season since its reasonable to assume that rashford will score a few more with prem, europa and fa cup games still to come before the season ends.
What does money and salaries have to do with comparing their abilities, Smalling costing less or being on less wages doesn't make his passing any better, he's still awful on the ball. Perhaps you should give Gareth Southgate and Ole a call, since both of them rate Maguire as the better player. One was a centre back and the other was a striker, so they know a thing or two about centre backs. Southgate has made maguire the linchpin of england's defence, smalling doesn't even get selected in the squad. Ole has made maguire captain, and sent smalling out on loan. Let me guess, when mourinho also wanted to sign maguire a year earlier, he was wrong too. Pep was wrong to rate maguire when city were looking at him. They were all wrong about maguire, but you are right, ok.
So he has put in excellent performances against the likes of mane, sterling, hazard despite having terrible positioning, than i guess his terrible positioning is not a problem since it doesn't seem to hinder his performances. By hook or by crook, he gets the job done...
I predicted that sanchez would fail at united, he had clearly already lost a yard of pace at arsenal and already seen his best days. He joined united because they offered him stupid wages, not for footballing reasons. It was a big mistake simple as that. He has not performed like the old alexis sanchez at inter either, the physical deterioration is very evident.
Zlatan did well for united actually considering his age, he helped them to win two trophies and is considered a success by most united fans. Unfortunately he sustained a serious injury which ruined his second season at the club but that was just bad luck. Matic and Mata have just done ok, decent signings, they haven't flopped but haven't pulled up any trees either. I don't recall Borthwick-Jackson ever being hyped, he wasn't regarded as a special talent in the academy at all. Van Gaal was the only one that saw something in him.
Any policy will fail if bad decisions are made, dortmund have had a huge amount of success in signing and developing young players. I don't know why you are making it about the academy here, i'm not talking about signing players for the academy, i'm talking about first team signings. Signing young players has some advantages, they are not going to decline rapidly due to age, they may not be on massive wages initially, and they won't completely lose their market value and be almost impossible to get rid of. They also have the potential to improve and become more valuable. Signing older proven players in the late 20's range can work, but its more fraught with danger due to the cost involved these days and the possibility of a rapid decline. Look at how difficult it now is for united to get rid of sanchez.
It is only your perception that they are ''providing the bare minimum'', the reality is very different.
You didn't say anything about open play goals statistics in your initial comment. Penalties still need to be scored, so they still count, however lets subtract them anyway. Rashford in his united career has scored 11 penalties. Just to remind you, you said ''He has the same goalscoring record as Welbeck had at his age''. Even if you subtract penalties its still 35 for welbeck versus 63 for rashford, so you are still way off the mark, and you'll only be even more off the mark by the end of the season since its reasonable to assume that rashford will score a few more with prem, europa and fa cup games still to come before the season ends.
What does money and salaries have to do with comparing their abilities, Smalling costing less or being on less wages doesn't make his passing any better, he's still awful on the ball. Perhaps you should give Gareth Southgate and Ole a call, since both of them rate Maguire as the better player. One was a centre back and the other was a striker, so they know a thing or two about centre backs. Southgate has made maguire the linchpin of england's defence, smalling doesn't even get selected in the squad. Ole has made maguire captain, and sent smalling out on loan. Let me guess, when mourinho also wanted to sign maguire a year earlier, he was wrong too. Pep was wrong to rate maguire when city were looking at him. They were all wrong about maguire, but you are right, ok.
So he has put in excellent performances against the likes of mane, sterling, hazard despite having terrible positioning, than i guess his terrible positioning is not a problem since it doesn't seem to hinder his performances. By hook or by crook, he gets the job done...
You don't seem to understand what I'm talking about. Should've said you're a Glazer apologist from the start.
I'm talking about standards of a club like Manchester United, which are in an absolute gutter due to people like you who are buying the BS Glazers and their puppet Solskjaer are selling.
In today's footballing world which is dominated by money, a club with the 3rd highest turnover in the world has no business signing players like Maguire, AWB, James - especially for the money they signed them for. Just a little bit more than a year ago standard with Mourinho was title or bust, CL semis or bust. Standards for players like Pogba, De Gea, Martial are huge, they're insulted for every average performance while you accept the bare minimum for players who "are actually excited and hungry to come and play for the club because it is a big step up in their careers ". Would you be happy if Kimmich or Di Maria or Carvajal or Bale were providing the same results AWB or James are? Would you be happy with the longest run without a clean sheet in 48 years, worst point total in 30, less clean sheets than fucking Watford if Ramos was CB instead of Maguire? Like fuck you would. Just like people aren't happy with what Pogba is serving or what Lukaku was serving even though they're miles better than whatever United have now. So stop lowering standards for these fuckers just because they cost less or they're British or they have a less recognizable name.
Solskjaer has more or less the same team Mourinho had then. Even better going by the logic that Ole got rid of deadwood and improved the transfer policy so much. So why do you accept this then?
A fan shouldn't care what a player cost, how soon they'll have to be replaced, how hard will it be to get rid of them etc. That's for the owners to worry about. Owners that get away with bad decisions because precious match goers keep giving them money they take out of United instead of putting pressure on them.
United finished last season 30 something points behind Liverpool and City. Now they're 37 behind Liverpool. And what are Glazers doing? How much money are they going to spend to bridge that gap? How do you think Perez would react being 37 points behind Barcelona?
No, that's an absolute fact. Proven by actual numbers in the table, goals conceded, clean sheets, assists etc etc. Refer back to Ramos-Maguire, AWB-Carvajal, James-Bale comparison up there.
Again, facts - not opinion or perception.
Yes penalties exist and need to be scored, but in case of Rashford they're very misleading since United have been given a record number of penalties which won't happen every season and the main penalty taker has been injured all season which won't happen every season.
Also, thank God ratios exist otherwise frauds like Rashford would get by on raw numbers alone.
A wise man once said "There's a reason why [Pogba] is worth €100 million and another player is worth €3m."
I expect a supposed WC CB, most expensive ever to improve the defense, not to barely scrape by (if at all) the standard Smalling and Jones set and not allow worst run w/o a clean sheet in 48 years, less clean sheets than Watford etc.
LMAO. Did you seriously just quote Gareth fucking Southgate and rape apologist Ole Glazer Solskjaer as authority on something? The fact they did those things only makes it worse. Especially the captain thing. You don't need further proof Ole is a Glazer puppet than the captaincy disgrace. He took the armband from DDG after he called the club out publicly and demanded more and gave it to Harry "4 relegations" Maguire. That great leader called getting within 37 pts of Liverpool 'big 3 points'. Gtfoh
Mourinho explained that while working for Sky. He said he was desperate for a CB and would've accepted anyone. But it was well known Alderweireld, Ramos before he extended his contract at RM were his first choices.
Mind you, great Ed Woodward mind, the man responsible for this great transfer policy you talk about, refused to sign that same Maguire for double less money than what he paid last summer.
Pep didn't rate him lmao. If he did he would've signed him.
I'm talking about standards of a club like Manchester United, which are in an absolute gutter due to people like you who are buying the BS Glazers and their puppet Solskjaer are selling.
In today's footballing world which is dominated by money, a club with the 3rd highest turnover in the world has no business signing players like Maguire, AWB, James - especially for the money they signed them for. Just a little bit more than a year ago standard with Mourinho was title or bust, CL semis or bust. Standards for players like Pogba, De Gea, Martial are huge, they're insulted for every average performance while you accept the bare minimum for players who "are actually excited and hungry to come and play for the club because it is a big step up in their careers ". Would you be happy if Kimmich or Di Maria or Carvajal or Bale were providing the same results AWB or James are? Would you be happy with the longest run without a clean sheet in 48 years, worst point total in 30, less clean sheets than fucking Watford if Ramos was CB instead of Maguire? Like fuck you would. Just like people aren't happy with what Pogba is serving or what Lukaku was serving even though they're miles better than whatever United have now. So stop lowering standards for these fuckers just because they cost less or they're British or they have a less recognizable name.
Solskjaer has more or less the same team Mourinho had then. Even better going by the logic that Ole got rid of deadwood and improved the transfer policy so much. So why do you accept this then?
A fan shouldn't care what a player cost, how soon they'll have to be replaced, how hard will it be to get rid of them etc. That's for the owners to worry about. Owners that get away with bad decisions because precious match goers keep giving them money they take out of United instead of putting pressure on them.
United finished last season 30 something points behind Liverpool and City. Now they're 37 behind Liverpool. And what are Glazers doing? How much money are they going to spend to bridge that gap? How do you think Perez would react being 37 points behind Barcelona?
No, that's an absolute fact. Proven by actual numbers in the table, goals conceded, clean sheets, assists etc etc. Refer back to Ramos-Maguire, AWB-Carvajal, James-Bale comparison up there.
Again, facts - not opinion or perception.
Yes penalties exist and need to be scored, but in case of Rashford they're very misleading since United have been given a record number of penalties which won't happen every season and the main penalty taker has been injured all season which won't happen every season.
Also, thank God ratios exist otherwise frauds like Rashford would get by on raw numbers alone.
A wise man once said "There's a reason why [Pogba] is worth €100 million and another player is worth €3m."
I expect a supposed WC CB, most expensive ever to improve the defense, not to barely scrape by (if at all) the standard Smalling and Jones set and not allow worst run w/o a clean sheet in 48 years, less clean sheets than Watford etc.
LMAO. Did you seriously just quote Gareth fucking Southgate and rape apologist Ole Glazer Solskjaer as authority on something?
The fact they did those things only makes it worse. Especially the captain thing. You don't need further proof Ole is a Glazer puppet than the captaincy disgrace. He took the armband from DDG after he called the club out publicly and demanded more and gave it to Harry "4 relegations" Maguire. That great leader called getting within 37 pts of Liverpool 'big 3 points'. GtfohMourinho explained that while working for Sky. He said he was desperate for a CB and would've accepted anyone. But it was well known Alderweireld, Ramos before he extended his contract at RM were his first choices.
Mind you, great Ed Woodward mind, the man responsible for this great transfer policy you talk about, refused to sign that same Maguire for double less money than what he paid last summer.
Pep didn't rate him lmao. If he did he would've signed him.
You don't seem to understand what I'm talking about. Should've said you're a Glazer apologist from the start.
I'm talking about standards of a club like Manchester United, which are in an absolute gutter due to people like you who are buying the BS Glazers and their puppet Solskjaer are selling.
In today's footballing world which is dominated by money, a club with the 3rd highest turnover in the world has no business signing players like Maguire, AWB, James - especially for the money they signed them for. Just a little bit more than a year ago standard with Mourinho was title or bust, CL semis or bust. Standards for players like Pogba, De Gea, Martial are huge, they're insulted for every average performance while you accept the bare minimum for players who "are actually excited and hungry to come and play for the club because it is a big step up in their careers ". Would you be happy if Kimmich or Di Maria or Carvajal or Bale were providing the same results AWB or James are? Would you be happy with the longest run without a clean sheet in 48 years, worst point total in 30, less clean sheets than fucking Watford if Ramos was CB instead of Maguire? Like fuck you would. Just like people aren't happy with what Pogba is serving or what Lukaku was serving even though they're miles better than whatever United have now. So stop lowering standards for these fuckers just because they cost less or they're British or they have a less recognizable name.
Solskjaer has more or less the same team Mourinho had then. Even better going by the logic that Ole got rid of deadwood and improved the transfer policy so much. So why do you accept this then?
A fan shouldn't care what a player cost, how soon they'll have to be replaced, how hard will it be to get rid of them etc. That's for the owners to worry about. Owners that get away with bad decisions because precious match goers keep giving them money they take out of United instead of putting pressure on them.
United finished last season 30 something points behind Liverpool and City. Now they're 37 behind Liverpool. And what are Glazers doing? How much money are they going to spend to bridge that gap? How do you think Perez would react being 37 points behind Barcelona?
No, that's an absolute fact. Proven by actual numbers in the table, goals conceded, clean sheets, assists etc etc. Refer back to Ramos-Maguire, AWB-Carvajal, James-Bale comparison up there.
Again, facts - not opinion or perception.
Yes penalties exist and need to be scored, but in case of Rashford they're very misleading since United have been given a record number of penalties which won't happen every season and the main penalty taker has been injured all season which won't happen every season.
Also, thank God ratios exist otherwise frauds like Rashford would get by on raw numbers alone.
A wise man once said "There's a reason why [Pogba] is worth €100 million and another player is worth €3m."
I expect a supposed WC CB, most expensive ever to improve the defense, not to barely scrape by (if at all) the standard Smalling and Jones set and not allow worst run w/o a clean sheet in 48 years, less clean sheets than Watford etc.
LMAO. Did you seriously just quote Gareth fucking Southgate and rape apologist Ole Glazer Solskjaer as authority on something? The fact they did those things only makes it worse. Especially the captain thing. You don't need further proof Ole is a Glazer puppet than the captaincy disgrace. He took the armband from DDG after he called the club out publicly and demanded more and gave it to Harry "4 relegations" Maguire. That great leader called getting within 37 pts of Liverpool 'big 3 points'. Gtfoh
Mourinho explained that while working for Sky. He said he was desperate for a CB and would've accepted anyone. But it was well known Alderweireld, Ramos before he extended his contract at RM were his first choices.
Mind you, great Ed Woodward mind, the man responsible for this great transfer policy you talk about, refused to sign that same Maguire for double less money than what he paid last summer.
Pep didn't rate him lmao. If he did he would've signed him.
I'm talking about standards of a club like Manchester United, which are in an absolute gutter due to people like you who are buying the BS Glazers and their puppet Solskjaer are selling.
In today's footballing world which is dominated by money, a club with the 3rd highest turnover in the world has no business signing players like Maguire, AWB, James - especially for the money they signed them for. Just a little bit more than a year ago standard with Mourinho was title or bust, CL semis or bust. Standards for players like Pogba, De Gea, Martial are huge, they're insulted for every average performance while you accept the bare minimum for players who "are actually excited and hungry to come and play for the club because it is a big step up in their careers ". Would you be happy if Kimmich or Di Maria or Carvajal or Bale were providing the same results AWB or James are? Would you be happy with the longest run without a clean sheet in 48 years, worst point total in 30, less clean sheets than fucking Watford if Ramos was CB instead of Maguire? Like fuck you would. Just like people aren't happy with what Pogba is serving or what Lukaku was serving even though they're miles better than whatever United have now. So stop lowering standards for these fuckers just because they cost less or they're British or they have a less recognizable name.
Solskjaer has more or less the same team Mourinho had then. Even better going by the logic that Ole got rid of deadwood and improved the transfer policy so much. So why do you accept this then?
A fan shouldn't care what a player cost, how soon they'll have to be replaced, how hard will it be to get rid of them etc. That's for the owners to worry about. Owners that get away with bad decisions because precious match goers keep giving them money they take out of United instead of putting pressure on them.
United finished last season 30 something points behind Liverpool and City. Now they're 37 behind Liverpool. And what are Glazers doing? How much money are they going to spend to bridge that gap? How do you think Perez would react being 37 points behind Barcelona?
No, that's an absolute fact. Proven by actual numbers in the table, goals conceded, clean sheets, assists etc etc. Refer back to Ramos-Maguire, AWB-Carvajal, James-Bale comparison up there.
Again, facts - not opinion or perception.
Yes penalties exist and need to be scored, but in case of Rashford they're very misleading since United have been given a record number of penalties which won't happen every season and the main penalty taker has been injured all season which won't happen every season.
Also, thank God ratios exist otherwise frauds like Rashford would get by on raw numbers alone.
A wise man once said "There's a reason why [Pogba] is worth €100 million and another player is worth €3m."
I expect a supposed WC CB, most expensive ever to improve the defense, not to barely scrape by (if at all) the standard Smalling and Jones set and not allow worst run w/o a clean sheet in 48 years, less clean sheets than Watford etc.
LMAO. Did you seriously just quote Gareth fucking Southgate and rape apologist Ole Glazer Solskjaer as authority on something?
The fact they did those things only makes it worse. Especially the captain thing. You don't need further proof Ole is a Glazer puppet than the captaincy disgrace. He took the armband from DDG after he called the club out publicly and demanded more and gave it to Harry "4 relegations" Maguire. That great leader called getting within 37 pts of Liverpool 'big 3 points'. GtfohMourinho explained that while working for Sky. He said he was desperate for a CB and would've accepted anyone. But it was well known Alderweireld, Ramos before he extended his contract at RM were his first choices.
Mind you, great Ed Woodward mind, the man responsible for this great transfer policy you talk about, refused to sign that same Maguire for double less money than what he paid last summer.
Pep didn't rate him lmao. If he did he would've signed him.
No business signing players like Maguire, AWB, James? You see this is the problem, you don't rate those players, I do rate them. It's a difference of opinion. I haven't lowered my standards, i just have a different opinion on those players than you and the passing of the time will show who is right or wrong about those players. James will be relegated to the role of squad player when Sancho or someone of his ilk comes in, as a squad player he is fine.
But you're the one that said this earlier: ''Smalling is without a shadow of a doubt a better player than Maguire right now. Especially when you take into account money and salaries, it's not close.''
If fans shouldn't care what a player costs, why are you bringing cost into the equation when comparing smalling with maguire, massive contradiction right there. You didn't address that before and you've just contradicted yourself on it here. I only care what a player costs in the sense that a late 20's, early 30's player on high wages who flops and suffers a rapid decline will be difficult to get rid of, and that affects a club's spending ability when it comes to strengthening other areas of the squad. Clubs often need to move on surplus high earners to avoid the wage bill spiralling out of control, so that is an obvious reason why fans should care.
Those numbers don't take all of the relevant variables into account, such as how good a job the midfield did in protecting the defence. It seems you want to put all of the blame on the back four for goals conceded, but in reality all 11 players contribute to defending. You said yourself that you thought mctominay was doing a bad job protecting the defence and things improved when matic came in.
He has only scored 11 in his whole career at united, and no matter if the regular taker was injured or not, he still had to step up and put them away so credit is still due. Penalties are a test of technique and composure, but you want to give zero credit for converting them. I suppose just any player would of stepped up in the 94th minute against psg and stuck it past buffon into the top corner under massive pressure right, you want to give him zero credit for that. The only thing i would have confidence in welbeck doing in that situation would be skying it into row z.
Once again, those ratio's don't account for all relevant variables. Welbeck was playing in a better team that challenged for the league every season under a legendary manager, in what way do the ratios account for that, they don't. Rashford is still well ahead of welbeck on overall goals, despite playing in a much worse team than welbeck over these years. Put Rashford into that united team that was challenging every year and then we'll compare ratios. He would easily have got into that united team ahead of welbeck since he's a far more talented player.
Again, there are more contributing factors than just the back four, united have had a lot of midfield issues this season.
Mourinho wasn't even at the club when united were trying to sign ramos, that was in 2015 when Van Gaal was still manager. Mourinho was still managing chelsea at that time. Ramos had already signed a new contract a year before Mourinho joined united, so you are talking more nonsense. I'm not even going to bother with the Alderweireld claim since its obvious you are just making stuff up.
[/QUOTE]
Pep didn't rate him huh:
Guardiola said: "Yeah. Maguire is an excellent, top-class player.
"We were interested, but we could not afford it. United afford it. He's an excellent player, national team too, he had an incredible World Cup.
"He's strong in the air, good with the ball, the build-up, he drives with the ball, he's fast, so fast. He has all the qualities. Congratulations to United for this signature."
But you're the one that said this earlier: ''Smalling is without a shadow of a doubt a better player than Maguire right now. Especially when you take into account money and salaries, it's not close.''
If fans shouldn't care what a player costs, why are you bringing cost into the equation when comparing smalling with maguire, massive contradiction right there. You didn't address that before and you've just contradicted yourself on it here. I only care what a player costs in the sense that a late 20's, early 30's player on high wages who flops and suffers a rapid decline will be difficult to get rid of, and that affects a club's spending ability when it comes to strengthening other areas of the squad. Clubs often need to move on surplus high earners to avoid the wage bill spiralling out of control, so that is an obvious reason why fans should care.
Those numbers don't take all of the relevant variables into account, such as how good a job the midfield did in protecting the defence. It seems you want to put all of the blame on the back four for goals conceded, but in reality all 11 players contribute to defending. You said yourself that you thought mctominay was doing a bad job protecting the defence and things improved when matic came in.
He has only scored 11 in his whole career at united, and no matter if the regular taker was injured or not, he still had to step up and put them away so credit is still due. Penalties are a test of technique and composure, but you want to give zero credit for converting them. I suppose just any player would of stepped up in the 94th minute against psg and stuck it past buffon into the top corner under massive pressure right, you want to give him zero credit for that. The only thing i would have confidence in welbeck doing in that situation would be skying it into row z.
Once again, those ratio's don't account for all relevant variables. Welbeck was playing in a better team that challenged for the league every season under a legendary manager, in what way do the ratios account for that, they don't. Rashford is still well ahead of welbeck on overall goals, despite playing in a much worse team than welbeck over these years. Put Rashford into that united team that was challenging every year and then we'll compare ratios. He would easily have got into that united team ahead of welbeck since he's a far more talented player.
Again, there are more contributing factors than just the back four, united have had a lot of midfield issues this season.
LMAO. Did you seriously just quote Gareth fucking Southgate and rape apologist Ole Glazer Solskjaer as authority on something? The fact they did those things only makes it worse. Especially the captain thing. You don't need further proof Ole is a Glazer puppet than the captaincy disgrace. He took the armband from DDG after he called the club out publicly and demanded more and gave it to Harry "4 relegations" Maguire. That great leader called getting within 37 pts of Liverpool 'big 3 points'. Gtfoh
Mourinho explained that while working for Sky. He said he was desperate for a CB and would've accepted anyone. But it was well known Alderweireld, Ramos before he extended his contract at RM were his first choices.
The fact they did those things only makes it worse. Especially the captain thing. You don't need further proof Ole is a Glazer puppet than the captaincy disgrace. He took the armband from DDG after he called the club out publicly and demanded more and gave it to Harry "4 relegations" Maguire. That great leader called getting within 37 pts of Liverpool 'big 3 points'. GtfohMourinho explained that while working for Sky. He said he was desperate for a CB and would've accepted anyone. But it was well known Alderweireld, Ramos before he extended his contract at RM were his first choices.
[/QUOTE]
Pep didn't rate him huh:
Guardiola said: "Yeah. Maguire is an excellent, top-class player.
"We were interested, but we could not afford it. United afford it. He's an excellent player, national team too, he had an incredible World Cup.
"He's strong in the air, good with the ball, the build-up, he drives with the ball, he's fast, so fast. He has all the qualities. Congratulations to United for this signature."
No, it's a difference between facts and opinion. United's season up to this point shows facts are right and your opinion doesn't matter.
And ofc you're lowering standards. You didn't answer my question - would you be happy if Ramos and Carvajal served up what AWB and Maguire did? Ofc you wouldn't. Thus lowering the standards. Either that or you're just lapping literally anything.
No, no. No contradiction. I said fans shouldn't care what someone cost in terms of how much money the club spent, did the owners save anything etc. But obviously if a player cost more I'm going to expect more from him. Otherwise they wouldn't cost that much.
But I suppose Smalling and Jones had Makelele, Gattuso and Casemiro in front of them?
And ofc the back four isn't solely responsible, but again, two huge signings in defense should improve things right? They haven't. In case you forgot - facts:
- worst point total in 30 years since signing these great players
- worst run without a clean sheet in 48 years since signing these great players
You want to tell me all the other 48 teams had better midfield protection?
Also, why is it that Lindelof and De Gea are blamed a lot for goals conceded when Maguire for example had as many mistakes as them? I have a hunch why.
And also, you're fixating on ONE part of AWB's game he does well while just brushing aside his complete lack of ability to do anything with the ball. Just look at this:
This is pathetic.
Boy you're really clinging to that Welbeck part lol.
1. Rashford played 4000 more minutes than Welbeck at United
2. You seem to be under the impression it's easier to score in a team full of champions and higher expectations. You're badly mistaken.
3. Talk about contradicting yourself - you're saying Rashford's PK vs PSG was an achievement bc of the pressure it took to score, but then saying Welbeck had it easier playing for a much better team with more pressure and more expectations.
4. Rashford has complete freedom to shoot whenever and however much he wants. He would've been sent back to the academy after 5 minutes in SAF's team
5. Ratios account for all of it bc obviously good players will play and score in any team and circumstance. That's why players like Suarez, Cavani, Lewa, Aguero etc. have the same or similar ratios wherever they played.
Yes, and those issues were exacerbated by OGS approving sales of midfielders without replacement, not playing his best available midfielder for half a season because whatever reason, forcing Pogba to play half-healthy against mighty Rochdale which resulted in him being out for the rest of the season, McTominay playing injured and then aggravating that injury etc. Same for Rashford btw. Martial missed more games this season than all the seasons before combined.
Great man, mind and thinker that rape apologist Ole is.
My mistake about Ramos, I mixed up the dates. Doesn't change the fact about Toby tho, no matter how much you don't bother.
Have you ever listened to Pep speak before? Every team, player he's asked about is always amazing, the best, great etc.
Even then, that's the man who signed Stones for a record fee and missed.
Even then, that's Pep's opinion which STILL doesn't change the FACTS about Harry Maguire.
And ofc you're lowering standards. You didn't answer my question - would you be happy if Ramos and Carvajal served up what AWB and Maguire did? Ofc you wouldn't. Thus lowering the standards. Either that or you're just lapping literally anything.
No, no. No contradiction. I said fans shouldn't care what someone cost in terms of how much money the club spent, did the owners save anything etc. But obviously if a player cost more I'm going to expect more from him. Otherwise they wouldn't cost that much.
But I suppose Smalling and Jones had Makelele, Gattuso and Casemiro in front of them?
And ofc the back four isn't solely responsible, but again, two huge signings in defense should improve things right? They haven't. In case you forgot - facts:
- worst point total in 30 years since signing these great players
- worst run without a clean sheet in 48 years since signing these great players
You want to tell me all the other 48 teams had better midfield protection?
Also, why is it that Lindelof and De Gea are blamed a lot for goals conceded when Maguire for example had as many mistakes as them? I have a hunch why.
And also, you're fixating on ONE part of AWB's game he does well while just brushing aside his complete lack of ability to do anything with the ball. Just look at this:
This is pathetic.
Boy you're really clinging to that Welbeck part lol.
1. Rashford played 4000 more minutes than Welbeck at United
2. You seem to be under the impression it's easier to score in a team full of champions and higher expectations. You're badly mistaken.
3. Talk about contradicting yourself - you're saying Rashford's PK vs PSG was an achievement bc of the pressure it took to score, but then saying Welbeck had it easier playing for a much better team with more pressure and more expectations.
4. Rashford has complete freedom to shoot whenever and however much he wants. He would've been sent back to the academy after 5 minutes in SAF's team
5. Ratios account for all of it bc obviously good players will play and score in any team and circumstance. That's why players like Suarez, Cavani, Lewa, Aguero etc. have the same or similar ratios wherever they played.
Yes, and those issues were exacerbated by OGS approving sales of midfielders without replacement, not playing his best available midfielder for half a season because whatever reason, forcing Pogba to play half-healthy against mighty Rochdale which resulted in him being out for the rest of the season, McTominay playing injured and then aggravating that injury etc. Same for Rashford btw. Martial missed more games this season than all the seasons before combined.
Great man, mind and thinker that rape apologist Ole is.
My mistake about Ramos, I mixed up the dates. Doesn't change the fact about Toby tho, no matter how much you don't bother.
Have you ever listened to Pep speak before? Every team, player he's asked about is always amazing, the best, great etc.
Even then, that's the man who signed Stones for a record fee and missed.
Even then, that's Pep's opinion which STILL doesn't change the FACTS about Harry Maguire.
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