Diplomatic mission
Seedorf dishes on Milan, Serie A and how to fix soccer
Il Professore, as AC Milan midfielder Clarence Seedorf is nicknamed in Italy, has earned his professorial moniker.
Over his career, the 31-year-old has played for four of the world's biggest clubs, including Milan, Real Madrid, Juventus and Ajax Amsterdam, where he first appeared as a 16-year-old whiz kid in November 1992. He has won four Champions League trophies, a Serie A Scudetto, a Spanish Liga crown and 81 caps for the Netherlands.
Born in Suriname, Seedorf is a legend who will never achieve the international name recognition of a David Beckham, yet he will go down as one of the most accomplished and successful players in history. Pelé named him one top 125 living players in 2004. And rightly so.
Seedorf doesn't posses the celestial talents of a Ronaldinho or the holy-(bleep) diligence of a Paolo Maldini, but he is a particular alloy of grace and discipline, capable of both wild bursts of brilliance and crunching industry.
So how strange was it when I met up with Seedorf earlier this summer, decked out in a stylish gray suit, signing autographs at the Warner Bros. stand at a consumer-products convention in New York City? It felt so wrong, like seeing a boxing champ greeting retirees in a Reno casino foyer.
But, as he has done throughout his career, Seedorf seemed to glide above the fray, ignoring the salesmen's viperous schmoozing and placating the curious onlookers -- and a few knowledgeable fans -- with smiles and signatures. It turns out he is as graceful off the field as he is on it. I caught up with Seedorf to talk about his career, AC Milan and Champions League.
SI.com: First of all, what is Clarence Seedorf doing in the States?
Seedorf: Promoting AC Milan and myself. But also trying to make it all happen in football, trying to grow the sport here. I think a lot of things have to be changed, a lot of mentality, to become a better football nation.
SI.com: Like what do you think needs to be changed?
Seedorf: Like, for some example, stop bringing in players who are at the end of their career. This is not good.
SI.com: Like Beckham?
Seedorf: Well, he's not really at the end point. He's got another four years. But most of the players who have been here are at the end of their career or are looking for something other than football, branding and that kind of thing.
SI.com: Who should MLS be looking at then?
Seedorf: I think they should bring players who are maybe difficult to find in clubs in Europe but want to showcase themselves and play here in the States, and then eventually go back to the bigger teams in Europe. That, in my opinion, would bring something to the States and it would also bring a lot of nationalities to world football. Because right now everything is very separate.
SI.com: What do you mean by separate?
Seedorf: Well, you see how FIFA and UEFA are ...
SI.com: They don't really like each other.
Seedorf: No. So you have players without vacation, like Kaká and Ronaldinho, who cannot go to play in the Copa América because then they would go three years without vacation. I think that's ridiculous. It should be managed in the same way, globally. Of course, you have spots where it's colder in certain moments of the year, but I think it would be better if they have the African Nations Cup, the European Cup and South American cup, all of them in the same period. Like in June.
SI.com: They could certainly do them all in the same year. If the European Championship is 2008, then the CONCACAF Gold Cup should be in 2008.
Seedorf: It's the same thing. But it's difficult to bring everything together, to help the game globally.
SI.com: This has been quite a year for you. What was going through your head at the beginning of last season when you heard about the Italian match-fixing scandal and AC Milan's subsequent points reduction?
Seedorf: That it was going to be a very difficult year. [Laughs] I was convinced that we could come back at some point in the year, but it was hard to dream in that moment that things would end like they did. I really believe in the work that we did, the daily effort everybody put in, and I said, "Something will happen here." It was all bad luck in the beginning. I think we hit like 13 or 14 posts in five games. And there were a lot of points lost there. So it was definitely hard.
SI.com: When did it turn?
Seedorf: It was a process. We were running against time. We wanted to reach December and still be alive. Which we managed to do. Then, from January, we started. And the path was, in the end, to our advantage.
SI.com: How much did the arrival of Ronaldo help?
Seedorf: Well, everything helped. He came here and he gave us just a little extra that helped us to get into the top-four position so we could get into the next year's Champions League. That was one of the most important goals, because winning the Champions League is never, you know, a bad thing. [Laughs.]
SI.com: Not at all. Last year, you won your fourth Champions League trophy. How does this one compare to the others?
Seedorf: It was probably the most difficult one. We had to play with all of the trouble. And the injustice.
SI.com: Injustice?
Seedorf: The fact that we paid for something that was a one-minute telephone conversation.
SI.com: Sure, but...
Seedorf: The fact is Juventus paid much more than they should have, and probably we shouldn't have paid anything. But in the end, it helped us. It unified the team. It made us a very strong team, especially since we lost a lot of important players like Andriy Shevchenko, Rui Costa, Jaap Stam.
SI.com: Were there any nerves about taking on Liverpool again?
Seedorf: Yeah, of course, it was a final. In a final, you cannot make mistakes. So you play a little differently. Finals generally are not very nice to see. The best European final I ever played in was against Liverpool and we lost. But then we played incredible football.
SI.com: But you got your revenge. What do you think about this season? AC Milan is kind of an old team.
Seedorf: Yeah, but it's not about age and I think we've shown that. We were one of the oldest teams in Europe and we won the Champions League. It's about understanding the system you are using.
SI.com: What do you think of Juve coming back to Serie A?
Seedorf: I'm happy. It's good for the game. Last year wasn't the same.
SI.com: That's true. The scandal in Italy obviously was a big deal. So it's odd to hear you say Milan was over-penalized because I know you have some strong opinions on the state of soccer today.
Seedorf: When I talk about general problems in football, I think about many things. How the talents in the sport are not managed in the proper way. How values are less and less important in the sport. Hopefully I will be able to help in the process to make some changes.
SI.com: What's the first thing you'd change?
Seedorf: Spread the values and improve the communication of the values. The biggest clubs should transfer their values. It can have a huge impact.
SI.com: For example?
Seedorf: I took the Champions League trophy to Suriname. They all wanted to see the cup. I saw in the eyes of the kids the hope only because somebody cared. It was just a very strong connection of values that I gave to them and they gave to me. Winning the cup doesn't mean anything. It's the achievement at the end of our hard work. We have an obligation to communicate with the world that it was hard work, that we helped each other. At the end of your career, you can look at how much you won. Yes, but what did you do with it? Did you give back to all the people? Like I said, it was beautiful to see all those people in Suriname.
SI.com: How important is it that the World Cup is going to South Africa in 2010?
Seedorf: That's big-time. I'm very happy that it will be my last World Cup, for sure, and that's in the country of Nelson Mandela, so I am really looking forward to it.
SI.com: And after 2010, you're thinking about retirement?
Seedorf: Yeah. But I've got another four years playing. I don't want to play the worst football at the end of my career. I want to go to 2010 World Cup and shine. On the other hand, I have the capability to prepare for my after-career. I want to make a huge impact in the world of football. I don't know how, but I have something big in my mind. I'm working on it, and studying at the university.
SI.com: What are you studying?
Seedorf: Management. I think a franchise has to be run like a business. It's not for nothing that four of the English clubs are owned and run by Americans. They run it like a business. I look at the NBA, and that's how I think the clubs should be run.
SI.com: Do you know any American athletes?
Seedorf: No, but Phil Jackson I like a lot. I read his book. I would like to meet him. Also, Oprah Winfrey is someone who really inspires me. The idea that doing good can still make a lot of money -- she has proven you don't have to be a bad personality to make money or do big things. And she was a great actress.
SI.com: Would you ever want to play in the U.S.?
Seedorf: It's not a reality anymore. I just signed four more years at AC Milan, but I want to help the game grow here. Everywhere, I am interested in changing the business of football and the football player.
SI.com: You think you can do that?
Seedorf: I can do that. Not by myself, but with other people. Nothing big has been done by one person alone.
Sportsillustrated
Seedorf dishes on Milan, Serie A and how to fix soccer
Il Professore, as AC Milan midfielder Clarence Seedorf is nicknamed in Italy, has earned his professorial moniker.
Over his career, the 31-year-old has played for four of the world's biggest clubs, including Milan, Real Madrid, Juventus and Ajax Amsterdam, where he first appeared as a 16-year-old whiz kid in November 1992. He has won four Champions League trophies, a Serie A Scudetto, a Spanish Liga crown and 81 caps for the Netherlands.
Born in Suriname, Seedorf is a legend who will never achieve the international name recognition of a David Beckham, yet he will go down as one of the most accomplished and successful players in history. Pelé named him one top 125 living players in 2004. And rightly so.
Seedorf doesn't posses the celestial talents of a Ronaldinho or the holy-(bleep) diligence of a Paolo Maldini, but he is a particular alloy of grace and discipline, capable of both wild bursts of brilliance and crunching industry.
So how strange was it when I met up with Seedorf earlier this summer, decked out in a stylish gray suit, signing autographs at the Warner Bros. stand at a consumer-products convention in New York City? It felt so wrong, like seeing a boxing champ greeting retirees in a Reno casino foyer.
But, as he has done throughout his career, Seedorf seemed to glide above the fray, ignoring the salesmen's viperous schmoozing and placating the curious onlookers -- and a few knowledgeable fans -- with smiles and signatures. It turns out he is as graceful off the field as he is on it. I caught up with Seedorf to talk about his career, AC Milan and Champions League.
SI.com: First of all, what is Clarence Seedorf doing in the States?
Seedorf: Promoting AC Milan and myself. But also trying to make it all happen in football, trying to grow the sport here. I think a lot of things have to be changed, a lot of mentality, to become a better football nation.
SI.com: Like what do you think needs to be changed?
Seedorf: Like, for some example, stop bringing in players who are at the end of their career. This is not good.
SI.com: Like Beckham?
Seedorf: Well, he's not really at the end point. He's got another four years. But most of the players who have been here are at the end of their career or are looking for something other than football, branding and that kind of thing.
SI.com: Who should MLS be looking at then?
Seedorf: I think they should bring players who are maybe difficult to find in clubs in Europe but want to showcase themselves and play here in the States, and then eventually go back to the bigger teams in Europe. That, in my opinion, would bring something to the States and it would also bring a lot of nationalities to world football. Because right now everything is very separate.
SI.com: What do you mean by separate?
Seedorf: Well, you see how FIFA and UEFA are ...
SI.com: They don't really like each other.
Seedorf: No. So you have players without vacation, like Kaká and Ronaldinho, who cannot go to play in the Copa América because then they would go three years without vacation. I think that's ridiculous. It should be managed in the same way, globally. Of course, you have spots where it's colder in certain moments of the year, but I think it would be better if they have the African Nations Cup, the European Cup and South American cup, all of them in the same period. Like in June.
SI.com: They could certainly do them all in the same year. If the European Championship is 2008, then the CONCACAF Gold Cup should be in 2008.
Seedorf: It's the same thing. But it's difficult to bring everything together, to help the game globally.
SI.com: This has been quite a year for you. What was going through your head at the beginning of last season when you heard about the Italian match-fixing scandal and AC Milan's subsequent points reduction?
Seedorf: That it was going to be a very difficult year. [Laughs] I was convinced that we could come back at some point in the year, but it was hard to dream in that moment that things would end like they did. I really believe in the work that we did, the daily effort everybody put in, and I said, "Something will happen here." It was all bad luck in the beginning. I think we hit like 13 or 14 posts in five games. And there were a lot of points lost there. So it was definitely hard.
SI.com: When did it turn?
Seedorf: It was a process. We were running against time. We wanted to reach December and still be alive. Which we managed to do. Then, from January, we started. And the path was, in the end, to our advantage.
SI.com: How much did the arrival of Ronaldo help?
Seedorf: Well, everything helped. He came here and he gave us just a little extra that helped us to get into the top-four position so we could get into the next year's Champions League. That was one of the most important goals, because winning the Champions League is never, you know, a bad thing. [Laughs.]
SI.com: Not at all. Last year, you won your fourth Champions League trophy. How does this one compare to the others?
Seedorf: It was probably the most difficult one. We had to play with all of the trouble. And the injustice.
SI.com: Injustice?
Seedorf: The fact that we paid for something that was a one-minute telephone conversation.
SI.com: Sure, but...
Seedorf: The fact is Juventus paid much more than they should have, and probably we shouldn't have paid anything. But in the end, it helped us. It unified the team. It made us a very strong team, especially since we lost a lot of important players like Andriy Shevchenko, Rui Costa, Jaap Stam.
SI.com: Were there any nerves about taking on Liverpool again?
Seedorf: Yeah, of course, it was a final. In a final, you cannot make mistakes. So you play a little differently. Finals generally are not very nice to see. The best European final I ever played in was against Liverpool and we lost. But then we played incredible football.
SI.com: But you got your revenge. What do you think about this season? AC Milan is kind of an old team.
Seedorf: Yeah, but it's not about age and I think we've shown that. We were one of the oldest teams in Europe and we won the Champions League. It's about understanding the system you are using.
SI.com: What do you think of Juve coming back to Serie A?
Seedorf: I'm happy. It's good for the game. Last year wasn't the same.
SI.com: That's true. The scandal in Italy obviously was a big deal. So it's odd to hear you say Milan was over-penalized because I know you have some strong opinions on the state of soccer today.
Seedorf: When I talk about general problems in football, I think about many things. How the talents in the sport are not managed in the proper way. How values are less and less important in the sport. Hopefully I will be able to help in the process to make some changes.
SI.com: What's the first thing you'd change?
Seedorf: Spread the values and improve the communication of the values. The biggest clubs should transfer their values. It can have a huge impact.
SI.com: For example?
Seedorf: I took the Champions League trophy to Suriname. They all wanted to see the cup. I saw in the eyes of the kids the hope only because somebody cared. It was just a very strong connection of values that I gave to them and they gave to me. Winning the cup doesn't mean anything. It's the achievement at the end of our hard work. We have an obligation to communicate with the world that it was hard work, that we helped each other. At the end of your career, you can look at how much you won. Yes, but what did you do with it? Did you give back to all the people? Like I said, it was beautiful to see all those people in Suriname.
SI.com: How important is it that the World Cup is going to South Africa in 2010?
Seedorf: That's big-time. I'm very happy that it will be my last World Cup, for sure, and that's in the country of Nelson Mandela, so I am really looking forward to it.
SI.com: And after 2010, you're thinking about retirement?
Seedorf: Yeah. But I've got another four years playing. I don't want to play the worst football at the end of my career. I want to go to 2010 World Cup and shine. On the other hand, I have the capability to prepare for my after-career. I want to make a huge impact in the world of football. I don't know how, but I have something big in my mind. I'm working on it, and studying at the university.
SI.com: What are you studying?
Seedorf: Management. I think a franchise has to be run like a business. It's not for nothing that four of the English clubs are owned and run by Americans. They run it like a business. I look at the NBA, and that's how I think the clubs should be run.
SI.com: Do you know any American athletes?
Seedorf: No, but Phil Jackson I like a lot. I read his book. I would like to meet him. Also, Oprah Winfrey is someone who really inspires me. The idea that doing good can still make a lot of money -- she has proven you don't have to be a bad personality to make money or do big things. And she was a great actress.
SI.com: Would you ever want to play in the U.S.?
Seedorf: It's not a reality anymore. I just signed four more years at AC Milan, but I want to help the game grow here. Everywhere, I am interested in changing the business of football and the football player.
SI.com: You think you can do that?
Seedorf: I can do that. Not by myself, but with other people. Nothing big has been done by one person alone.
Sportsillustrated
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That is so true. SOB always scores against Juve. :groan: