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  1. #41
    Juventuz addict Stephan's Avatar

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    My only issue/question is that this guy is younger than Rugani and Caldara. But he is already more established, so how is that going to help the development race for our next big italian things?

    I would think Gimenez would be bought to start with Chiellini then right? Barzagli looks old and slow now in this preseason and Benatia is not trustworthy.


    In that sense, loaning Rugani to Atletico would be interesting, Simeone would do him good and with Gimenez and Savic he has proven he can make them good at young age. So that type of experience would be great for Rugani for example. Rugani wont get better if he sits on our bench here. Dont buy into that he can learn so much from training with Chiellini and Barzagli. You need actual games. The funny thing is that a year from now, when Barzagli might call it a day, Caldara might have outdeveloped Rugani cause he is playing regularly for Atalanta.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephan View Post
    I would take him over Manolas and that Vrij guy for sure.

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    You kidding? Dont watch much CL other than Juve?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hustini View Post
    its been a tough year for me
    We love you just the way you are.

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    TS mention also Garay.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark View Post
    We love you just the way you are.

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    TS mention also Garay.
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  5. #45
    Juventuz legend Post Ironic's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephan View Post
    My only issue/question is that this guy is younger than Rugani and Caldara. But he is already more established, so how is that going to help the development race for our next big italian things?

    I would think Gimenez would be bought to start with Chiellini then right? Barzagli looks old and slow now in this preseason and Benatia is not trustworthy.


    In that sense, loaning Rugani to Atletico would be interesting, Simeone would do him good and with Gimenez and Savic he has proven he can make them good at young age. So that type of experience would be great for Rugani for example. Rugani wont get better if he sits on our bench here. Dont buy into that he can learn so much from training with Chiellini and Barzagli. You need actual games. The funny thing is that a year from now, when Barzagli might call it a day, Caldara might have outdeveloped Rugani cause he is playing regularly for Atalanta.
    You kidding? Don't watch much Juve, eh? Too busy watching other teams?

    Rugani played 1560 minutes last season. Would have been more if not for a 1 month injury to finish the season. Also played 1490 minutes the season before, and that's with not playing a single minute in the first 16 rounds of serie A. So, over the last 1.5 seasons, Rugani has played 3050 minutes. Plenty of time.

    Sitting on the bench... Loan him out...

    It's been a prevalent notion. Fallen sparks. Fragments of vessels broken at the Creation. And someday, somehow, before the end, a gathering back to home. A messenger from the Kingdom, arriving at the last moment. But I tell you there is no such message, no such home -- only the millions of last moments . . . nothing more. Our history is an aggregate of last moments.

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hustini View Post
    Love to be loved





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  7. #47
    Juventuz addict Stephan's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Post Ironic View Post
    You kidding? Don't watch much Juve, eh? Too busy watching other teams?

    Rugani played 1560 minutes last season. Would have been more if not for a 1 month injury to finish the season. Also played 1490 minutes the season before, and that's with not playing a single minute in the first 16 rounds of serie A. So, over the last 1.5 seasons, Rugani has played 3050 minutes. Plenty of time.

    Sitting on the bench... Loan him out...

    Excuse me?

    If we sign Gimenez we are going to play Gimenez-Chiellini in the starting XI. We arent playing a back 3 anymore. So where are those minutes going to come? Also Allegri is hesitant to put someone like Rugani on in a big CL night cause he does lack experience.

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    Show me the table/source of your stats cause wiki says Rugani made least apps of all our defenders.

  8. #48
    Juventuz legend Post Ironic's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephan View Post
    Excuse me?

    If we sign Gimenez we are going to play Gimenez-Chiellini in the starting XI. We arent playing a back 3 anymore. So where are those minutes going to come? Also Allegri is hesitant to put someone like Rugani on in a big CL night cause he does lack experience.
    You contradict yourself. Barza and Benatia are so bad or untrustworthy they can't play according to you, but we should go into the season with only Gimenez-Chiello in front of them and loan out Rugani?

    Even if Gimenez or another top CB were to come, Rugani will get tons of time on the pitch. Good thing the club isn't retarded enough to loan him out.

    He'll get minimum 1500 minutes again this season (barring long-term injury), and that's just fine and dandy for development.

    - - - Updated - - -

    https://www.transfermarkt.com/daniel.../0?saison=2016

    Rugani 2016-17 minutes. You can crosscheck it with whoscored.
    It's been a prevalent notion. Fallen sparks. Fragments of vessels broken at the Creation. And someday, somehow, before the end, a gathering back to home. A messenger from the Kingdom, arriving at the last moment. But I tell you there is no such message, no such home -- only the millions of last moments . . . nothing more. Our history is an aggregate of last moments.

  9. #49
    Juventuz addict Stephan's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Post Ironic View Post
    You contradict yourself. Barza and Benatia are so bad or untrustworthy they can't play according to you, but we should go into the
    season with only Gimenez-Chiello in front of them and loan out Rugani?

    Even if Gimenez or another top CB were to come, Rugani will get tons of time on the pitch. Good thing the club isn't retarded enough to loan him out.

    He'll get minimum 1500 minutes again this season (barring long-term injury), and that's just fine and dandy for development.
    Im not contradicting anything. Rugani could have played already more last season, why did we even go and buy Benatia then? Why? That clearly shows certain questions in terms how much Allegri trusts to put on a kid like Rugani.

    Wikipedia tells me Benatia made more apps in CL last season than Rugani. Again like i said, i dont believe Allegri would put on Rugani in a big game like CL match, (he didnt make the bench of CL either in the final).


    This season preseason shows that age is getting on Barzagli, but he can be a useful backup option. I cant quite figure Benatia out tbh, he has injury problems, and this preaseason he hasnt been impressive at all.


    Lets put it this way, say we sign Gimenez: We will have Chiellini, Gimenez, Benatia, Barzagli, Rugani. If Allegri plays back 4, you think Rugani will make a CL bench regularly if all fit? He will get odd game start in coppa italia like was the case last season.

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    Juventuz legend Post Ironic's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephan View Post
    Im not contradicting anything. Rugani could have played already more last season, why did we even go and buy Benatia then? Why? That clearly shows certain questions in terms how much Allegri trusts to put on a kid like Rugani.

    Wikipedia tells me Benatia made more apps in CL last season than Rugani. Again like i said, i dont believe Allegri would put on Rugani in a big game like CL match, (he didnt make the bench of CL either in the final).
    Of course he didn't make the bench of the final. He was injured for the entire month leading up to the final and hadn't played a competitive match since mid-April.

    We bought Benatia because he was cheap for a defender of his quality, and because we want 4-5 quality CBs in our squad. Add to that Barza aging, and Bonucci causing problems which sounds like it was an ongoing thing over the last year...

    Obviously the idea is Chiello, Rugani, Caldara, Benatia starting next year. If they could bring back Caldara early, I doubt we'd be going after Gimenez.
    It's been a prevalent notion. Fallen sparks. Fragments of vessels broken at the Creation. And someday, somehow, before the end, a gathering back to home. A messenger from the Kingdom, arriving at the last moment. But I tell you there is no such message, no such home -- only the millions of last moments . . . nothing more. Our history is an aggregate of last moments.

  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wittl View Post
    I meant the player thread once we sign him
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  12. #52
    Juventuz addict Stephan's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Post Ironic View Post
    Of course he didn't make the bench of the final. He was injured for the entire month leading up to the final and hadn't played a competitive match since mid-April.
    We will have Chiellini, Gimenez, Benatia, Barzagli, Rugani. If Allegri plays back 4, you think Rugani will make a CL bench regularly if all fit? He will get odd game start in coppa italia like was the case last season.

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    Juventuz legend Post Ironic's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephan View Post
    We will have Chiellini, Gimenez, Benatia, Barzagli, Rugani. If Allegri plays back 4, you think Rugani will make a CL bench regularly if all fit? He will get odd game start in coppa italia like was the case last season.
    Yeah. The odd game in Coppa Italia.

    Meanwhile, reality strikes Stephan when he realizes Rugani started 11 Serie A games, and 2 CL matches, the supercoppa, and 2 coppa matches last season, over half of those starts coming in the back half of the season in a back 4.. When we had Bonucci, Chiello, Barza, Benatia as well.

    Odd game in coppa.
    It's been a prevalent notion. Fallen sparks. Fragments of vessels broken at the Creation. And someday, somehow, before the end, a gathering back to home. A messenger from the Kingdom, arriving at the last moment. But I tell you there is no such message, no such home -- only the millions of last moments . . . nothing more. Our history is an aggregate of last moments.

  14. #54
    Juventuz addict Stephan's Avatar

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    I already asked your source for those app stats, you didnt provide it.

  15. #55
    Juventuz legend Post Ironic's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephan View Post
    I already asked your source for those app stats, you didnt provide it.
    Scroll up. I linked it. You're a joke, bro. You can't even take the time to suss out a site that shows minutes and appearances, and make outlandish claims based upon nothing. You clearly don't watch Juve often if you think Rugani only occasionally plays in Coppa.

    Rugani started 13 matches last season in all comps in which Juventus used a back 4. Played the 90 in all of them.
    It's been a prevalent notion. Fallen sparks. Fragments of vessels broken at the Creation. And someday, somehow, before the end, a gathering back to home. A messenger from the Kingdom, arriving at the last moment. But I tell you there is no such message, no such home -- only the millions of last moments . . . nothing more. Our history is an aggregate of last moments.

  16. #56
    Juventuz addict Stephan's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Post Ironic View Post
    Of course he didn't make the bench of the final. He was injured for the entire month leading up to the final and hadn't played a competitive match since mid-April.

    We bought Benatia because he was cheap for a defender of his quality, and because we want 4-5 quality CBs in our squad. Add to that Barza aging, and Bonucci causing problems which sounds like it was an ongoing thing over the last year...

    Obviously the idea is Chiello, Rugani, Caldara, Benatia starting next year. If they could bring back Caldara early, I doubt we'd be going after Gimenez
    .
    Why are we chasing Gimenez then? He would cost a top dollar probably. Gimenez because of his age would be a long term signing. But he wont be some cheap alternative signing to a say Manolas. And in a years time we would have Gimenez here ahead of Caldara and Rugani still.

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    Juventuz legend Post Ironic's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephan View Post
    Why are we chasing Gimenez then? He would cost a top dollar probably. Gimenez because of his age would be a long term signing. But he wont be some cheap alternative signing to a say Manolas. And in a years time we would have Gimenez here ahead of Caldara and Rugani still.
    And in a year Barza will likely be done, Chiello will be 34, Benatia still injury prone and past 30.

    3 young CBs + Chiellini + half a Benatia. Add to that there is a good chance we offload Benatia next summer if he doesn't pan out this year. Our management seems to want 5 CBs. And seeing the injury crisis we had his past season where Evra was playing in a back 3 at times, I don't have a problem with it.

    If we get Gimenez, I'd hope we offload Benatia over the next couple years. Chiello-Gimenez-Rugani-Caldara would be immense for the next few years until Chiello is done.
    It's been a prevalent notion. Fallen sparks. Fragments of vessels broken at the Creation. And someday, somehow, before the end, a gathering back to home. A messenger from the Kingdom, arriving at the last moment. But I tell you there is no such message, no such home -- only the millions of last moments . . . nothing more. Our history is an aggregate of last moments.

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    Post ironic I thought you were gonna take a break from Tuz
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  19. #59
    Juventuz legend Post Ironic's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hustini View Post
    Post ironic I thought you were gonna take a break from Tuz
    After about 3-4 weeks without posting much (I was banned for part of it), I missed this place.
    It's been a prevalent notion. Fallen sparks. Fragments of vessels broken at the Creation. And someday, somehow, before the end, a gathering back to home. A messenger from the Kingdom, arriving at the last moment. But I tell you there is no such message, no such home -- only the millions of last moments . . . nothing more. Our history is an aggregate of last moments.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Post Ironic View Post
    And in a year Barza will likely be done, Chiello will be 34, Benatia still injury prone and past 30.

    3 young CBs + Chiellini + half a Benatia. Add to that there is a good chance we offload Benatia next summer if he doesn't pan out this year. Our management seems to want 5 CBs. And seeing the injury crisis we had his past season where Evra was playing in a back 3 at times, I don't have a problem with it.

    If we get Gimenez, I'd hope we offload Benatia over the next couple years. Chiello-Gimenez-Rugani-Caldara would be immense for the next few years until Chiello is done.
    Barza is already done, mate. And Benatia has looked like Bambi since spring.

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