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  1. #561
    Juventuz regular Afghan_juventus's Avatar

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    I've been bingewatching the Szczesney Show, this dude is one funny $#@!.

    We better let him do some $#@! on our channel aswell.

    Also great to see him doing so well. Best possible Buffon successor.

  2. #562
    Juventuz champion pitbull's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xperd View Post
    Well not really. It's just that you haven't seen him in recent seasons and you're still stuck in the past judging by his Arsenal days and you probably believe nothing has changed much since then or atleast you were initially.
    €14M is chump change these days. He sure as hell done enough already to not be considered an 'overpaid' 2nd GK.
    Storari was a competent 2nd gk and cost us 4.5m and had a salary half the size of Sczcesny's, Manninger was a decent 2nd gk and was signed for 2.5m and had a 1/3 salary of Sczcesny's. I don't think I've ever seen a club invest much in a 2nd goalie unless it's someone they plan to groom into the first goalie, if he doesn't become 1st goalie for us, we'll probably try to move him on, he's too expensive to be 2nd number.

    Don't get me wrong, polak is doing very well so far and has already done everything to deserve a shot to be our number one when Buffon retires, but trust me, it'll be a whole different environment when he'll be our Nr 1 goalie and Buffon successor, this season is relatively pressure free compared to that. I'm just expecting worse than you, time will tell, hopefully you'll be right.
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  3. #563
    Legendary G.O.A.T Xperd's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by pitbull View Post
    Storari was a competent 2nd gk and cost us 4.5m and had a salary half the size of Sczcesny's, Manninger was a decent 2nd gk and was signed for 2.5m and had a 1/3 salary of Sczcesny's. I don't think I've ever seen a club invest much in a 2nd goalie unless it's someone they plan to groom into the first goalie, if he doesn't become 1st goalie for us, we'll probably try to move him on, he's too expensive to be 2nd number.

    Don't get me wrong, polak is doing very well so far and has already done everything to deserve a shot to be our number one when Buffon retires, but trust me, it'll be a whole different environment when he'll be our Nr 1 goalie and Buffon successor, this season is relatively pressure free compared to that. I'm just expecting worse than you, time will tell, hopefully you'll be right.
    Well it was pretty obvious to me that we bought him to be the eventual no.1. What else did you think ?
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  4. #564
    Juventuz champion pitbull's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xperd View Post
    Well it was pretty obvious to me that we bought him to be the eventual no.1. What else did you think ?
    Well it was pretty obvious to me too given the finances we dedicated to his purchase, I'm just not sure he's good enough to be Gigi's successor and I don't think we'll make sure of that this season. Before the season started I was pretty sure he's not good enough, now I'm starting to have my doubts as he's done very well while Gigi's been out
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  5. #565
    Juventuz star Rollie's Avatar
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    Transfer fees were obviously a lot different in 2008 and 2010.

    Both of those guys are also older than Gigi, obviously never a possibility to be in line as his successor, and Manninger was even the 3rd string keeper for awhile. Neither was purchased by Juventus with the idea that they were buying one of the league's best.

    I don't really get the transfer fee or salary comparisons, Pitbull. Buffon is 40 in 3 days, Szczęsny is basically entering his prime years, arrived after a year where he was right at the top of his craft in Serie A, and at this point everybody has indicated that the plan is for him to be Gigi's successor -- including Gigi, Szczęsny, and management. That writing has always been on the wall.

    It'll be different around the club and in the locker room once Buffon is gone, but there's no real reason to think Wojciech will suddenly and randomly go off the rails. He's still going to have a better defense and team in front of him than he had at Roma, and if he plays like he did last year, and like he has this year, the club has its new #1.

    If for some strange reason he doesn't turn out to be the guy they want to stick with, 12.2M + 3.1M in Bonuses is amortized over 4 years. So any outgoing transfer fee easily covers any potential loss.... it's really a no-lose situation, as far as I can tell. Even if he bangs all the WAGs of Beppe and Co. during the second half of the season, and has to go, they'd still only have to get around 11.5M this summer to clean up the books.

    Another successful market opportunity for the braintrust!

  6. #566
    Juventuz champion pitbull's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rollie View Post
    Transfer fees were obviously a lot different in 2008 and 2010.

    Both of those guys are also older than Gigi, obviously never a possibility to be in line as his successor, and Manninger was even the 3rd string keeper for awhile. Neither was purchased by Juventus with the idea that they were buying one of the league's best.

    I don't really get the transfer fee or salary comparisons, Pitbull. Buffon is 40 in 3 days, Szczęsny is basically entering his prime years, arrived after a year where he was right at the top of his craft in Serie A, and at this point everybody has indicated that the plan is for him to be Gigi's successor -- including Gigi, Szczęsny, and management. That writing has always been on the wall.

    It'll be different around the club and in the locker room once Buffon is gone, but there's no real reason to think Wojciech will suddenly and randomly go off the rails. He's still going to have a better defense and team in front of him than he had at Roma, and if he plays like he did last year, and like he has this year, the club has its new #1.

    If for some strange reason he doesn't turn out to be the guy they want to stick with, 12.2M + 3.1M in Bonuses is amortized over 4 years. So any outgoing transfer fee easily covers any potential loss.... it's really a no-lose situation, as far as I can tell. Even if he bangs all the WAGs of Beppe and Co. during the second half of the season, and has to go, they'd still only have to get around 11.5M this summer to clean up the books.

    Another successful market opportunity for the braintrust!
    The transfer fee comparisons is to show that both Juve and pretty much every club wants their back up to be experienced, reliable and cheap, Sturaro and Neto are probably as high-end as 2nd goalkeepers get. Sorry if I did not make myself clear, we practically agree on this, Sczcesny was never meant to be the 2nd gk long term and if he became one he'd be too good and expensive for that.

    Sczcesny did well at Roma, but not well enough for them to keep him as their #1 goalie. He didn't do well at Arsenal and they also didn't want to keep him. For Polish NT it seems he finally might be edging out Swansea Nr1 Lukas Fabianski. Surely I'm not the only one to think that this guy isn't a 100% guarantee to sooth our pain when Buffon finally retires?
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  7. #567
    C.V juventino320's Avatar

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    Szczęsny is doing great till now and he proved that he is a good investment for a low amount of money considering todays market, i think its pointless to discuss if he is fit to be our no.1 gk, regardless if gigi retired this year end or the next and regardless if Szczęsny will be our first gk or not in every scenario we got a good keeper in hand, i think
    Szczęsny will keep his good form and can improve even more after all juve is a better team than roma or arsenal with better environment.

  8. #568
    Legendary G.O.A.T Xperd's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by pitbull View Post

    Sczcesny did well at Roma, but not well enough for them to keep him as their #1 goalie. He didn't do well at Arsenal and they also didn't want to keep him. For Polish NT it seems he finally might be edging out Swansea Nr1 Lukas Fabianski. Surely I'm not the only one to think that this guy isn't a 100% guarantee to sooth our pain when Buffon finally retires?
    I don't know why you keep harping on this point. Roma dint buy him because they had already invested on Allison before hand who's now proving to be one of the best keepers the league

    What choice Roma made doesn't determine his quality. They're a selling club who'd naturally look for more economical options(Allison being one). Arsenal already had Cech while Szczesny was on loan at Roma so it doesn't make sense for them to push Cech out of the club for Szczesny.

    You don't watch him and you're judging him based on the choices made by Arsenal and Roma.... It seems for you players can't improve over time. (Szczesny had the most clean sheets in the league last year)

    But by all means keep pushing this as some sort of relevant argument
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    Juventuz champion pitbull's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xperd View Post
    I don't know why you keep harping on this point. Roma dint buy him because they had already invested on Allison before hand who's now proving to be one of the best keepers the league

    What choice Roma made doesn't determine his quality. They're a selling club who'd naturally look for more economical options(Allison being one). Arsenal already had Cech while Szczesny was on loan at Roma so it doesn't make sense for them to push Cech out of the club for Szczesny.

    You don't watch him and you're judging him based on the choices made by Arsenal and Roma.... It seems for you players can't improve over time. (Szczesny had the most clean sheets in the league last year)

    But by all means keep pushing this as some sort of relevant argument..

    - - - Updated - - -

    And please don't compare him to Neto. He's a clear tier above him.
    Is Alison really an economic choice? I don't see much financial difference between them. And I also don't understand how you figured out that I don't watch him. I've seen a bit of him at Arsenal, a bit more for Roma and I've seen him for Juventus, but that's a small portion of his career, obviously I'm also going to include other facts like his previous clubs not deciding to hold onto him.

    All I wanted to say is it's not time yet to throw rocks at those who said that Woj might not be a good Buffon replacement, Gigi is still around and clearly our number one. Until Buffon hangs up his gloves and Woj is thrown in at the deep end, I see no reason to continue this discussion, it's going nowhere.
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    Legendary G.O.A.T Xperd's Avatar

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    Of course Allison is an economical choice. He's on dirt cheap wages and cost 2x less than what Szczesny would have potentially cost for them. Why would a club like Roma who are literally run like a supermarket invest in Szczesny when they already have a promising goalie in their ranks ? Let's remember that they don't have the same resources like us. So it's a complete non argument for me. Roma dint buy him not because 'He wasn't good enough' for them but just that they chose to direct their funds elsewhere especially while having a promising goalie in their ranks who as I said, is one of the best keepers in league already. So their choice proved worth for them.
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    Juventuz champion pitbull's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xperd View Post
    Of course Allison is an economical choice. He's on dirt cheap wages and cost 2x less than what Szczesny would have potentially cost for them. Why would a club like Roma who are literally run like a supermarket invest in Szczesny when they already have a promising goalie in their ranks ? Let's remember that they don't have the same resources like us. So it's a complete non argument for me. Roma dint buy him not because 'He wasn't good enough' for them but just that they chose to direct their funds elsewhere especially while having a promising goalie in their ranks who as I said, is one of the best keepers in league already. So their choice proved worth for them.
    Poor Romans bought Allison while they already had Woj in 2016, effectively deciding not to hold onto Sczcesny in 2016/17. You're assuming they cannot afford Woj, but I somehow doubt that, Schick purchase seems to indicate they're not as broke as you might think
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  12. #572
    Legendary G.O.A.T Xperd's Avatar

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    Looks like we're going around in circles here.

    The point was NOT about whether Roma were able to afford him or not.
    But seeing as they have less resources, they should prudently use it. Now GK is not often a position you spend a lot of money on. You have to go back as earlier as 2001 for the most money spent on a GK.

    Heck we could have bought another GK for €60-€70M easily but why did we go on to sign Szczesny? It's because we need to make sure we have enough money to address other problems. We are not sitting on a billion pound warchest so we have to manage our resources more effectively. Szczesny was a market opportunity we happened to capitalise on and he's someone who'll help us a lot in this transitional period once Buffon retires.

    As for Roma able to buy Schick, they sell half their squad every summer , heck they're selling their best players in January so obviously they would have some money to spend.
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  13. #573
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xperd View Post
    Looks like we're going around in circles here.

    The point was NOT about whether Roma were able to afford him or not.
    But seeing as they have less resources, they should prudently use it. Now GK is not often a position you spend a lot of money on. You have to go back as earlier as 2001 for the most money spent on a GK.

    Heck we could have bought another GK for €60-€70M easily but why did we go on to sign Szczesny? It's because we need to make sure we have enough money to address other problems. We are not sitting on a billion pound warchest so we have to manage our resources more effectively. Szczesny was a market opportunity we happened to capitalise on and he's someone who'll help us a lot in this transitional period once Buffon retires.

    As for Roma able to buy Schick, they sell half their squad every summer , heck they're selling their best players in January so obviously they would have some money to spend.
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  14. #574
    Juventuz star Rollie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pitbull View Post
    The transfer fee comparisons is to show that both Juve and pretty much every club wants their back up to be experienced, reliable and cheap, Sturaro and Neto are probably as high-end as 2nd goalkeepers get. Sorry if I did not make myself clear, we practically agree on this, Sczcesny was never meant to be the 2nd gk long term and if he became one he'd be too good and expensive for that.

    Sczcesny did well at Roma, but not well enough for them to keep him as their #1 goalie. He didn't do well at Arsenal and they also didn't want to keep him. For Polish NT it seems he finally might be edging out Swansea Nr1 Lukas Fabianski. Surely I'm not the only one to think that this guy isn't a 100% guarantee to sooth our pain when Buffon finally retires?
    Ah, okay, got you on the transfer fee part.

    As fort the bolded part, though, I don't really agree with that. He played really well at Roma, but they had already fully purchased Alisson -- who is quite a good keeper in his own right. They were a bit overloaded at the position, and went with the cheaper, younger option for financial reasons. IMO.

    As for the 'he didn't do well at Arsenal' part, he wasn't good at Arsenal, but I think they did want to keep him given what he had produced at Roma -- pretty sure I remember an interview with Wenger saying as much. By that time, though, Sczcęsny didn't want to go back -- he wanted to play for the most glorious club in all the land.

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