Israeli-Palestinian conflict - News and Politics - Juventuz Forums - Page 626

View Poll Results: Is Hamas a Terrorist Organization?

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  • Yes

    33 42.31%
  • No

    38 48.72%
  • Should there be a Jewish nation SOMEWHERE in the world?

    0 0%
  • Yes

    34 43.59%
  • No

    37 47.44%
  • Should Israel be a country located in the region it is right now?

    0 0%
  • Yes

    26 33.33%
  • No

    47 60.26%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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  1. #12501
    Grazie Mirko Nzoric's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Klovn View Post


    Nothing new with murcias though
    He's italien tho.

    Jeg kan se ham nægte mig creme fraiche på min pizza midt i min brandert.

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    at der Führer var en visionær af klasse
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  2. #12502
    Juventuz legend Post Ironic's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by AndreaCristiano View Post
    This doesn’t help conversation. It’s not all one sided like you and some on here believe. There is another view point no matter if you like it or not. Mocking me won’t change that
    Mocking you is better than discussing things with you. Everyone knows your point of view before you type a single word.
    It's been a prevalent notion. Fallen sparks. Fragments of vessels broken at the Creation. And someday, somehow, before the end, a gathering back to home. A messenger from the Kingdom, arriving at the last moment. But I tell you there is no such message, no such home -- only the millions of last moments . . . nothing more. Our history is an aggregate of last moments.

  3. #12503
    Grazie Mirko Nzoric's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by AndreaCristiano View Post
    This doesn’t help conversation. It’s not all one sided like you and some on here believe. There is another view point no matter if you like it or not. Mocking me won’t change that
    Whats the point of debating with you? You quote a page from some book or blog thats obviously not peer reviewed and when contested you dodge the arguments like Depp dodging bats in Fear and Loathing.

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  4. #12504
    Juventuz legend Post Ironic's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maddy View Post
    I'm half huguenot. Does that give me a claim to France according to Sinkesandalen?

    If it wasn't for that pesky god-ordered genocide, we should probably give Jerusalem back to the "Canaanites"...
    It's been a prevalent notion. Fallen sparks. Fragments of vessels broken at the Creation. And someday, somehow, before the end, a gathering back to home. A messenger from the Kingdom, arriving at the last moment. But I tell you there is no such message, no such home -- only the millions of last moments . . . nothing more. Our history is an aggregate of last moments.

  5. #12505
    Grazie Mirko Nzoric's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Post Ironic View Post
    If it wasn't for that pesky god-ordered genocide, we should probably give Jerusalem back to the "Canaanites"...
    We should stick with biblical ethnicites

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  6. #12506
    Juventuz regular Tomice's Avatar

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  7. #12507
    King of Chlamydia Maddy's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nzoric View Post
    We should stick with biblical ethnicites

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    Never read the Bible. What were the name of the germanic tribes?
    Much Love, bitches!

  8. #12508
    Grazie Mirko Nzoric's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maddy View Post
    Never read the Bible. What were the name of the germanic tribes?
    Beats me

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    Would be surprised if theyre mentioned
    En sidste kommentar herfra sku' lige være den
    at der Führer var en visionær af klasse
    der såfremt han var til stede den dag i dag
    ville la' fattigrøve & skvadderhoveder gasse

  9. #12509
    Juventuz legend Post Ironic's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maddy View Post
    Never read the Bible. What were the name of the germanic tribes?
    I prefer Herodotus. Told much better stories.
    It's been a prevalent notion. Fallen sparks. Fragments of vessels broken at the Creation. And someday, somehow, before the end, a gathering back to home. A messenger from the Kingdom, arriving at the last moment. But I tell you there is no such message, no such home -- only the millions of last moments . . . nothing more. Our history is an aggregate of last moments.

  10. #12510
    King of Chlamydia Maddy's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nzoric View Post
    Beats me

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    Would be surprised if theyre mentioned
    Wait a sec. So the words of god doesn't mention every tribe, people, etc. of the earth? Only the tribes and people known to the people claiming this to be the words of god?

    I'm sorry. Wasn't the Bible peer-reviewed prior to publication?

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Post Ironic View Post
    I prefer Herodotus. Told much better stories.
    Heretic.
    Much Love, bitches!

  11. #12511
    Pretty Handsome Awkward DAiDEViL's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maddy View Post
    Oh dear. The Colossus of Enlightenment just entered the thread.

      Spoiler:
    @Osman
    DAiDEViL is a minority of minorities: female assigned at birth, mostly black, disabled, genderqueer, aromantic, pansexual, kinky, demisexual, poor, noetisexual, polyamorous, singleish, RA, a survivor, intersex, bipolar AND left-handed. 😭😰

  12. #12512
    Juventuz legend king Ale's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tomice View Post
    I won't respond to the whole post since I've given you my thought on that subject already few pages back and it's addressed to Deneb anyway. I will just that you can absolutely separate Hamas from the people and one must do so in order to understand the current issue.

    I call it being aware, as much as you want to suggest I know the palestinians better than you ever will. I live with them, worked with them and I've spent three years in Gaza and saw first hand how they live and what troubles them.

    I see them as adult, not once suggested otherwise. However one can't possibly ignore how those living conditions and poverty, being shut out from the world all while being oppressed under a fanatical regime affect the ability to make rational and independent choices. They are just humans and all humans will behave the same under those conditions, it has nothing to do with them being arab/muslim/palestinians whatever.
    You don't see them as adults who have the capacity to choose for themselves. If you did, you wouldn't be able to separate them from Hamas. I understand why one would want to make that distinction though. Nobody buys calling a people a bunch of savage bloodthristy terrorists, so it's easier to target a small group (i.e., Hamas), claim that THEY are responsible for the grim situation there, and frame dead people as unfortunate collateral damage. I'm not saying you make the distinction for that purpose, but your government does and that works.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tomice View Post
    Have you ever seen what the Hamas "educational" tv programs for kids look like? Broken down, mostly poorly educated people, some even brainwashed who see no hope for the future do irrational things and are easier to control and exploit. Then let me rephrase just for the sake of it , they are doing it out of free will, but only in the frame of options that are made available to them by Hamas. Better now?
    Nope, not better now. I don't even understand how you can be so sure about what drives and motivates other people to make certain decisions. Maybe you are brainwashed by the Israeli propaganda to believe that? How is that less likely than your thesis?


    Quote Originally Posted by Tomice View Post
    Also I fail to see what's hypocritical exactly and I don't pretend to be upset, I'm not at all upset. I'm saddened. I went to visit my parents two days ago and I saw my mom crying in front of the T.V to a piece about the living conditions in Gaza. vast majority of Israelis don't take pleasure from seeing those images and aren't happy about any of it, I won't pretend to be anything I'm not for the sake of people on an internet forum I will probably never meet, and that you can take to the bank. If it's not an honest conversation what are we doing?.
    Ever since the beginning of the protests, the point I've been making here is that there is one group to blame, and that's the one that kills. You cannot blame Hamas/people and be upset about the lost lives, because they got what they deserved after all, fully aware of the consequences of their actions. Since when is the death of a person who intends to harm other people and is shot by the police upsetting us? I don't get it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tomice View Post
    You completly ducked the quastion I see
    I 100% meant it. Stop killing the people.

    As an Iranian, the Israeli-Palestinian conflict has been a relevant topic throughout my adult life. My hatred for the ruling regime in Iran has made it difficult for me to sympathize with and find reason in anything they are supporting and promoting. Also, those who know me know that I'm not a person seeing the world as extreme black vs extreme white. But among all the issues that I have an opinion on, the Israeli-Palestinian conflict has become the most binary one during all these years. I understand that what's going there is a result of one group having completely outpowered the other, but this power imbalance has inevitably led to clearly defined (for me) rights and wrongs in this conflict.
    289[+2]

    “Hope” is the thing with feathers -
    That perches in the soul -
    And sings the tune without the words -
    And never stops - at all -


    قالوا الم تکن ارض الله واسعة فتهاجروا فیها

  13. #12513
    Juventuz legend Post Ironic's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maddy View Post
    Wait a sec. So the words of god doesn't mention every tribe, people, etc. of the earth? Only the tribes and people known to the people claiming this to be the words of god?

    I'm sorry. Wasn't the Bible peer-reviewed prior to publication?

    - - - Updated - - -



    Heretic.
    I already feel trapped within my burning tomb.
    It's been a prevalent notion. Fallen sparks. Fragments of vessels broken at the Creation. And someday, somehow, before the end, a gathering back to home. A messenger from the Kingdom, arriving at the last moment. But I tell you there is no such message, no such home -- only the millions of last moments . . . nothing more. Our history is an aggregate of last moments.

  14. #12514
    PEACE BE UPON YOU AndreaCristiano's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by king Ale View Post
    You don't see them as adults who have the capacity to choose for themselves. If you did, you wouldn't be able to separate them from Hamas. I understand why one would want to make that distinction though. Nobody buys calling a people a bunch of savage bloodthristy terrorists, so it's easier to target a small group (i.e., Hamas), claim that THEY are responsible for the grim situation there, and frame dead people as unfortunate collateral damage. I'm not saying you make the distinction for that purpose, but your government does and that works.



    Nope, not better now. I don't even understand how you can be so sure about what drives and motivates other people to make certain decisions. Maybe you are brainwashed by the Israeli propaganda to believe that? How is that less likely than your thesis?




    Ever since the beginning of the protests, the point I've been making here is that there is one group to blame, and that's the one that kills. You cannot blame Hamas/people and be upset about the lost lives, because they got what they deserved after all, fully aware of the consequences of their actions. Since when is the death of a person who intends to harm other people and is shot by the police upsetting us? I don't get it.



    I 100% meant it. Stop killing the people.

    As an Iranian, the Israeli-Palestinian conflict has been a relevant topic throughout my adult life. My hatred for the ruling regime in Iran has made it difficult for me to sympathize with and find reason in anything they are supporting and promoting. Also, those who know me know that I'm not a person seeing the world as extreme black vs extreme white. But among all the issues that I have an opinion on, the Israeli-Palestinian conflict has become the most binary one during all these years. I understand that what's going there is a result of one group having completely outpowered the other, but this power imbalance has inevitably led to clearly defined (for me) rights and wrongs in this conflict.
    Very good post.
    "Of all ignorance, the ignorance of the educated is the most dangerous. Not only are educated people likely to have more influence, they are the last people to suspect that they don't know what they are talking about when they go outside their narrow fields." THOMAS SOWELL

  15. #12515
    Juventuz legend Linebreak's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by GordoDeCentral View Post
    Way to dumb down the conversation
    As I said, that's as simple as the entire matter is, and Israeli's are terrified of people learning about the simplicity of the matter because it means they have zero moral leg to stand on and everything else is just noise. Israel is an occupying European force - just look at all the Israeli leaders, their ancestry comes from various parts of the former Russian empire, Poland, other parts of Europe etc.
    Netenyahu's ancestory is Polish-Russian. Ben Gurion was Polish. But oh, apparently, some of their ancestors lived in Palestine 2000 years ago, so they have some sort of right to come in and kill everyone, even though most Russian Jews are actually Askhenazi, not ethnically Hebrew, rather, Jewish converts. Even if we give them the 2000 year old story, if I remember correctly David defeated Goliath the Palestinian, so even the Hebrews are outsiders?

    All the other crap Israelis throw out there, like terrorism, is just noise to legitimise themselves. Just like Apartheid, their farcical state will eventually fall in a heap. It's not a sustainable model and never will be.
    A lot of needless innocent blood will be shed before then of course.

  16. #12516
    Ohaulick ALC's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maddy View Post
    Oh dear. The Colossus of Enlightenment just entered the thread.

    that guy’s reaction is the best

  17. #12517
    Juventuz regular BayernFan's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by Linebreak View Post
    As I said, that's as simple as the entire matter is, and Israeli's are terrified of people learning about the simplicity of the matter because it means they have zero moral leg to stand on and everything else is just noise. Israel is an occupying European force - just look at all the Israeli leaders, their ancestry comes from various parts of the former Russian empire, Poland, other parts of Europe etc.
    Netenyahu's ancestory is Polish-Russian. Ben Gurion was Polish. But oh, apparently, some of their ancestors lived in Palestine 2000 years ago, so they have some sort of right to come in and kill everyone, even though most Russian Jews are actually Askhenazi, not ethnically Hebrew, rather, Jewish converts. Even if we give them the 2000 year old story, if I remember correctly David defeated Goliath the Palestinian, so even the Hebrews are outsiders?

    All the other crap Israelis throw out there, like terrorism, is just noise to legitimise themselves. Just like Apartheid, their farcical state will eventually fall in a heap. It's not a sustainable model and never will be.
    A lot of needless innocent blood will be shed before then of course.
    So much occupying that they plenty of times offered the Palestinians their land



    But but but its always those $#@!ing Israelis faulth!!!!

  18. #12518
    PEACE BE UPON YOU AndreaCristiano's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by BayernFan View Post
    So much occupying that they plenty of times offered the Palestinians their land



    But but but its always those $#@!ing Israelis faulth!!!!
    The narrative now is that Israel is the enemy while Palestine is the oppressed. It’s sad because it’s revisionist.
    "Of all ignorance, the ignorance of the educated is the most dangerous. Not only are educated people likely to have more influence, they are the last people to suspect that they don't know what they are talking about when they go outside their narrow fields." THOMAS SOWELL

  19. #12519
    Juventuz regular BayernFan's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by AndreaCristiano View Post
    The narrative now is that Israel is the enemy while Palestine is the oppressed. It’s sad because it’s revisionist.
    Its the victime role. And many Europeans buy totally into that crap.

  20. #12520
    Grazie Mirko Nzoric's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by AndreaCristiano View Post
    The narrative now is that Israel is the enemy while Palestine is the oppressed. It’s sad because it’s revisionist.
    Why does revisionism make you sad?

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